Impressions Setup - Flashlight Technique

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Furbyland

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For those of you that have at least started out with this toe in/out, have found that the best position you ended up with had MORE or LESS toe in/out applied ? I’ve been at that approx position but am leaning towards a bit more toe in as I’ve noticed that about 2 feet behind the flashlight 1/3 position is a bit better soundstage than my ‘ideal’ one. Thoughts ?
 

Lightloopy

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Sounds like you are in the right direction. The flashlight method is a reasonable starting point but you are clearly listening for the best results. Trust your ears. Same applies to the other positioning parameters. Enjoy.
 

ttocs

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For a couple years mine have been extremely toed-in with the flashlight being about 1/4 inside of the OUTER edge. I've been sitting a little closer than equidistant. But, both speakers are not mirror images of each other. The right speaker is about 4-1/2" farther from the front wall than the left. Why? Center of image. Watch the video referenced below.

I came across a speaker setup explanation presented at the Rocky Mountain Audio Fest. I was hesitant to try it for months after watching the video, but then I decided it was time. No tools, only ears. I did exactly what was said in the video and came away with a great soundstage. My room is a multi-purpose great-room with the system close to the right wall, so the left speaker is in the middle of the front wall. Nothing equal about it. But the soundstage is great! I get fooled often by sound emanating from beyond the speakers, and this has been with minimal room treatment (which I'm currently working on, so I'll need to re-tweak the speakers).

I highly suggest watching the entire video, otherwise know that you'll be missing some great info. But the speaker setup begins at 18:05 minutes into the video.


So I'm using physical placement for centering the image, not using Levels.
Watch the video and play the song that's mentioned.
The processor levels for both channels are equal.
The processor distance settings for both channels are equal.
The physical distance of each speaker is not the same.
The Toe Angle of each speaker is not exactly the same
(distance changes the flashlight incidence so can't be used the same way, but it's close).
The Rake Angles are the same.
 

Lightloopy

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Thanks for posting this video. I also found it very helpful. In the end, it's ok for the speakers not to be exactly the same distances and the fine tuning is all done by ear.
 

jacksky

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As he says in the video, planar speakers are more sensitive side to side than front to back distance.
I need the back wall to be 12-18” from speaker for the panel.....BUT i need to tame the woofer boom but having the speaker (Monoliths) farther out in the room . Ahhh, compromises.
 

Furbyland

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For a couple years mine have been extremely toed-in with the flashlight being about 1/4 inside of the OUTER edge. I've been sitting a little closer than equidistant. But, both speakers are not mirror images of each other. The right speaker is about 4-1/2" farther from the front wall than the left. Why? Center of image. Watch the video referenced below.

I came across a speaker setup explanation presented at the Rocky Mountain Audio Fest. I was hesitant to try it for months after watching the video, but then I decided it was time. No tools, only ears. I did exactly what was said in the video and came away with a great soundstage. My room is a multi-purpose great-room with the system close to the right wall, so the left speaker is in the middle of the front wall. Nothing equal about it. But the soundstage is great! I get fooled often by sound emanating from beyond the speakers, and this has been with minimal room treatment (which I'm currently working on, so I'll need to re-tweak the speakers).

I highly suggest watching the entire video, otherwise know that you'll be missing some great info. But the speaker setup begins at 18:05 minutes into the video.


So I'm using physical placement for centering the image, not using Levels.
Watch the video and play the song that's mentioned.
The processor levels for both channels are equal.
The processor distance settings for both channels are equal.
The physical distance of each speaker is not the same.
The Toe Angle of each speaker is not exactly the same
(distance changes the flashlight incidence so can't be used the same way, but it's close).
The Rake Angles are the same.


Awesome response. Have you, or do you use ML ARC along with this? I ask, because currently I have a loaded ARC profile in each speaker. Wonder if I should remove, do this process, then redo ARC, or, forgo all together?
 
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ttocs

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Awesome response. Have you, or do you use ML ARC along with this? I ask, because currently I have a loaded ARC profile in each speaker. Wonder if I should remove, do this process, then redo ARC, or, forgo all together?
Whenever I move a speaker, ARC is always disabled and becomes meaningless in its new location. After maneuvering the speakers into place I then enable ARC on the speakers and run the ARC app for a fresh correction. It's easy enough to run ARC and I have found it to be better with ARC than without. Plus, I run Dirac on the processor and it smooths out the bass even more, but I only let Dirac correct below 400-500Hz, and it varies based upon how Dirac's measurement looks. The main thing I am after here is to not let Dirac correct much of what comes from the stat panels. If I had a different room, different layout, my opinion on this could likely be different, but this is what I've found works for me.
 

Furbyland

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Whenever I move a speaker, ARC is always disabled and becomes meaningless in its new location. After maneuvering the speakers into place I then enable ARC on the speakers and run the ARC app for a fresh correction. It's easy enough to run ARC and I have found it to be better with ARC than without. Plus, I run Dirac on the processor and it smooths out the bass even more, but I only let Dirac correct below 400-500Hz, and it varies based upon how Dirac's measurement looks. The main thing I am after here is to not let Dirac correct much of what comes from the stat panels. If I had a different room, different layout, my opinion on this could likely be different, but this is what I've found works for me.

Makes total sense. Thank you!
 

Fidji99

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My life hack for toe-in - I use 2 stickers - one in front was used to have exact match to 1/3 distance [so aligning with flaslight]
Now I find much ore useful to align sticker on the back with panel side - if I have stickers on both speakers in the same distance visually, I know I am doing it right [flaslight is a bit crude for me, as I am symmetry freak]

1653127032823.png
 

Lightloopy

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The video set up from RMAF was helpful to me in that it allowed me to relax and just tune the placement by ear. Things may not line up but that's ok as long as it sounds fine to you. I have found that the final settings I play with are toe in and sliding the seat back and forth a bit. Run the ARC and I'm done.
 
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