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Just spiked my Summits

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Gordon Gray

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Howdy all,

After 7 months of listening, I finally spiked the Summits directly into my wood floor. Had the spikes previously set on brass discs. Amazing difference due to less vibration / better floor coupling I assume. Imaging snapped into place, dimensionality better defined, and the mid bass / bass much tighter. Highly recommend if you can live with 8 little holes in your wood floor. This, of course, would apply to any ML speaker.

GG
 

stereoman

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Hi:
I recently placed wood platforms (from Ikea!) unders my Summits (http://www.martinloganowners.com/~tdacquis/forum/showthread.php?t=2110&page=2). They produced the same improvements to the bass as you experienced. I'm using AudioQuest floor protectors under the spikes. I'll try removing them so the spikes go directly into the platforms (better than damaging the hardwood floor :eek: ) to see if this results in any improvement to the bass.

Bill.
 

Gordon Gray

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Tell me what you hear

Bill,

Tell me the results of your direct spiking if you can. When I first listened after the spikes were put directly into the floor, the sound "warmed up" a bit. Decreased the 50HZ crossover by about a 1/3rd of a DB and it took care of that. Good luck.

Gordon
 

stereoman

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Hi Gordon:
I removed the AudioQuest floor protectors and placed the Summit's spikes directly on the wood platform. I immediately noticed an improvement in midrange clarity. I could hear performance hall echoes that I never noticed before. Surprisingly, I haven't noticed any change in the base frequencies.

Below is a picture of the wood platform with the AudioQuest floor protectors removed from the spikes. Thanks for the great tip.
 

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Gordon Gray

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Glad you noticed a difference

Bill,

Glad you tried and glad it improved the midrange. My theory is that the speaker is better coupled to the floor (read less vibration) and hence better midrange clarity and focus. Regarding the bass "bump" I heard, it took just a minor tweak. Since then, I've bumped the 50HZ control up just a touch and decreased the 25HZ control a hair. Amazing how sensitive but adjustable the Summits are and how much difference a properly tuned mid bass / bass can influence the entire musical listening experience from top to bottom. By the way, I also hear much more of the ambient background of the recording venue once I spiked the Summits and less vibration coming thru the floor with bass heavy material.

As I said in my original post, this is applicable to all ML models and all speakers in general. Just goes to prove again that vibration is the bane of audio.

Best regards,

GG
 

liffy99

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Spikes on concrete

I have carpet (+underlay) on a concrete floor.
What have people found using the spikes (still gliding my Prodigys around a little at the moment). OK through the carpet, or better into a wooden base on top of the carpet (or anything else) ?

Cheers :eek:
 

kach22i

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When you guys get serious about securing your speakers to the floor, let me know. :D
 

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Gordon Gray

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Funny boy

Hey Kach,

Loved your bolt to floor / concrete detail. You're a funny guy.

Regarding the Prodigy spiking question, its all about reducing vibration. My sense would be to have a separate platform spiked into the concrete and then spike the speakers into that platform. Mapleshade has excellent brass cones for this type of installation. You may want to call Pierre, at Mapleshade, to get his recommendation.

Regardless, by all means, try it. I can guarantee you that it will make an audible (much to the better) difference.

GG
 

DTB300

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Wood Platforms

If people are looking for some really nice wood platforms, here is a web site of a person who makes the platforms along with other fine wood items.

http://www.timbernation.com/

He advertises on Audiogon too...


Dan
 

SugarMedia

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Didn't Roberto once post a list of woods, and which ones resonate less than others?
 

Craig

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I believe Roberto refered to Mike Vansevers's work on resonating properties of wood and other materials when listed the varying resonating characteristics of various woods. Please correct me if I'm wrong Roberto.

Mike has done a lot of work and experimentation in this area and is the most knowledgeable person I know when it comes to the effect different kinds of wood have on audio gear. He has spent many years examining and experimenting with the properties of many materials in addition to wood and and designed and built many devices designed to tweak and fine-tune audio systems and musical instruments. He is also very good at repairing and modifying vintage tube gear and has some pretty cool classic and custom pieces in his shop.

He lives here in Tampa and is very active in our Tampa Bay Listening Society. We often hold our meetings in his shop and it's always very interesting to check out all the vintage and esoteric audio components and tubes lying around.

His business is in this field and I'm not trying to make a plug for him but he is an interesting and enjoyable person to talk audio and were glad to have him as an active member in our local audio club. There is plenty of reading of reading material on his web site if your interested in another perspective and observation on tweaking audio systems. Just here to let you know he is a good resource for audio tweaking info.

http://www.vansevers.com/main.html
 

roberto

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Craig said:
I believe Roberto refered to Mike Vansevers's work on resonating properties of wood and other materials when listed the varying resonating characteristics of various woods. Please correct me if I'm wrong Roberto.

Mike has done a lot of work and experimentation in this area and is the most knowledgeable person I know when it comes to the effect different kinds of wood have on audio gear. He has spent many years examining and experimenting with the properties of many materials in addition to wood and and designed and built many devices designed to tweak and fine-tune audio systems and musical instruments. He is also very good at repairing and modifying vintage tube gear and has some pretty cool classic and custom pieces in his shop.

He lives here in Tampa and is very active in our Tampa Bay Listening Society. We often hold our meetings in his shop and it's always very interesting to check out all the vintage and esoteric audio components and tubes lying around.

His business is in this field and I'm not trying to make a plug for him but he is an interesting and enjoyable person to talk audio and were glad to have him as an active member in our local audio club. There is plenty of reading of reading material on his web site if your interested in another perspective and observation on tweaking audio systems. Just here to let you know he is a good resource for audio tweaking info.

http://www.vansevers.com/main.html
Hola...well yes a no. Mike has done an incredible work of art and effort. I was experimenting with wood resonances too and you might remember that I lost all my info. that was in my hard disk of my stollen laptop. I am not saying that my work was also better than Mike´s, but here in Costa Rica it is so easy to get so many great sounding nice woods, and believe when I say this...the guys at Shun Mook also encouraged me to try to understand the resonances and the importance of them in a high-end audio system. I am in love with the sound of Cocobolo (hard wood similar to ebony) and Cristobal, another find wood...our Marimbas (kind of vives made out of wood and bamboo) has the notes made of Cristobal, and if you use other wood, they do not sound as loud as when you have it. So there are woods that sound cleaner and louder than others...here is where my findings were done...I did try to teach some regarding this, but need you time, effort and preparation for it...it is good to know that some of you think the same way as I do...wood helps the sound for better and more harmonic texture is present when you use it...you can make a dull sound to become live and sweet...happy listening my friends,
Roberto.
 

Craig

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I envy your easy access to some of the most beautiful tropical hardwoods in the world. You can buy them in Tampa but you'd be shocked at how much they cost per board foot. For example Cocobolo is about $36 per foot when available. I intend to visit Costa Rica with my brother within the year (my brother is married to a Costa Rican girl) and will pay you a visit when I do.
 

roberto

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Craig said:
I envy your easy access to some of the most beautiful tropical hardwoods in the world. You can buy them in Tampa but you'd be shocked at how much they cost per board foot. For example Cocobolo is about $36 per foot when available. I intend to visit Costa Rica with my brother within the year (my brother is married to a Costa Rican girl) and will pay you a visit when I do.
Hola Graig...if I were you, perhaps I would have the same sense...and it is true...I am living in a Paradise...still it is easy to get fine woods at a very good price...it is called sympathetic resonance too...when you have an E (6th string plucked at the 5th frett, it is an A tone, same as 5th string in Spanish guitar)....when you hit the string, you will notice that both are moving...in other words, due to the same frequency, both are singing at the same frequency....and it is the same with lower tones and uppertones... when music is in our room, everything is singing with the music...the plastic on top of our cd player...etc...it is causing to sing with the music, so we might have a plastic or brigth sound...with wood, we can match the sound energy at a very natural tone and right with timbre, no matter the kind of music. It is difficult to explain, but the truth is that with wood blocks around in our systme, music sings better, and it is easy to hear the difference. Some wood sings louder than other, and this kind of wood, is the one that we normally used in the musical instruments. If you have these kind of wood around your system, will sing with the music, and will kill the bad resonance and will make your room to be more life like...happy listening,
Roberto.
 
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kach22i

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roberto said:
...it is called sympathetic resonance too... everything is singing with the music... we can match the sound energy at a very natural tone and right with timbre..... Some wood sings louder than other...
This theory works more than with just wood, it applies to all materials - yes plastic too, he's right. Going with the wood example for a moment, I think several generalization can be made. Soft wood sounds soft/mushy but warm. A hard wood like maple can have a nice solid snap, light on the color............another hard wood like red oak can be overly grainy in
sound .

I've done my list several times, steel is cold and hard, glass is clear but glares.......etc. I love composite grinding disks myself.

Whats under (or on) your equipment?

http://www.martinloganowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=341

Image alone:
 
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Gordon Gray

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Try maple

Hey folks,

For what its worth, Pierre Sprey of Mapleshade swears by maple. He has numerous options available (different sizes , thicknesses, etc.) on his website / catalogue.

GG
 

roberto

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Gordon Gray said:
Hey folks,

For what its worth, Pierre Sprey of Mapleshade swears by maple. He has numerous options available (different sizes , thicknesses, etc.) on his website / catalogue.

GG
Hola Gordon...I can´t say anything for Maple wood. Is it used in muscial instruments? If it is a yes, then it is right for the application...as I said before, trust your ears, listen for some time music that you like most with wood, and then without, then make up conclusions...you will notice easelly the wonder sound of wood...everything will become sweet and with more harmonic texture than without it...happy listening,
Roberto.
 

Jeff Zaret

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Roberto,
Yes it is used in musical instruments. There are many acoustic guitars, steel string versions, which have maple sides and backs. Typically it is curly maple which is visually very nice.

Just a side note way off topic. :D

Jeff :cool:
 

roberto

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Jeff Zaret said:
Roberto,
Yes it is used in musical instruments. There are many acoustic guitars, steel string versions, which have maple sides and backs. Typically it is curly maple which is visually very nice.

Just a side note way off topic. :D

Jeff :cool:
Thanks a lot Jeff...it is good to know it...if it is easy to get, give it a try...just small pieces of wood around your system, on top of your cd player, preamp, power amp, everything, use three pieces on every component, this is not an expesive tweak, and make sense...have your Spanish or wood guitar next to your seat, it would be sounding with its harmonics when the sound exites it...all of our room is exited by the sound from our speakers, right?...so we can have wood around us, with the caracteristics of it, a simple conclusion...won´t harm to do it, and for those that will think this is crazy...it is o.k. too. Some of us can tell it, perhaps you are one of us...if you use a three big pieces of wood touching your cd player chassis in a triagule position, not the rubber feet, and play some music that you are used to the image, the stage, and listen carefully with this tweak, and tell us what have happened to your new sound and stage...happy listening,
Roberto.
 
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