Gordon Gray
Well-known member
Not a surprise. That is one great ffing speaker.
System #95 (ReQuest originally, then CLS IIz , now YG Acoustic Carmel's)
- Thread starter MiTT
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User211
Well-known member
I've just heard the Ref 1 with Chord electronics at the Bristol Hi-Fi show over here. Be interesting to see what you think, Tim.
MiTT
Super User
I just posted some thoughts on them over in Tom's thread on the comparison of the LS50's to the Motions Justin. I really liked them quite a bit actually driven by a Unison Research tube amp and a Rega CD player. Next step will be to bring them home for an audition in my system in my room, but I do believe they will be what I end up with. As I say in the other thread, the sins of the LS50 are sins of omission compared to the Ref 1's. It's easy to hear that the tweeters in the Ref 1's are superior (supposedly the Uni-Q array in the Ref 1 is identical to that in the Blade), and obviously the bass extension in the Ref 1 is much better. There's magic in the crossover too - tons of resolution.
What were you're thoughts Justin? I know you're often reserved about your opinions, but don't be afraid to share.
User211
Well-known member
My thoughts were do not listen to them with Chord electronics Tim. One guy was complaining he had to get out because his ears hurt 
Being realistic I am sure they can do MUCH better than I heard there. The LS50 is a spanking good speaker for the money.
So there you go - no reservations that time.
Get them home Tim and don't let that sway you.
Being realistic I am sure they can do MUCH better than I heard there. The LS50 is a spanking good speaker for the money.
So there you go - no reservations that time.
Get them home Tim and don't let that sway you.
User211
Well-known member
BTW Tim I virtually never like the sound in Chord rooms. I pretty much always think their gear sounds dire.
MiTT
Super User
I actually share your thoughts here Justin. I heard a big stack of their electronics with some Wilson-Bensch speakers once and didn't care for it at all, but then heard the same speakers with some other electronics (can't recall which now), and liked the speakers quite a bit. I did hear the Chord Hugo DAC driving a headphone rig at Can Jam last year and it sounded good.
Yes, next step is to hear the Ref 1's with my electronics and then form a solid opinion.
User211
Well-known member
Definitely. They are not cheap so be really sure they work with your gear Tim.
MiTT
Super User
So some of you may have noticed that I have both my CLS's and the LS-50's up for sale in the Marketplace right now. I've spent the last six months or so listening to speakers ranging from the KEF Reference 1's to the Joseph Audio Pulsars, to the Sonus Faber Olympica 1,2 & 3's as well as a myriad of others that just haven't merited comment. I'm listening to the wonderful little LS-50's right now for what will be the last time in my system before I take them down and box them up for their next potential owner. Tomorrow morning I leave for Chicago on a very quick business trip and by the time I return I shall have a crate awaiting me containing my new (and very likely my last) speakers.
Last fall I mentioned here that I had visited the YG Acoustics factory as it is only about a half hour from where I live. In my coverage of the Rocky Mountain Audio Fest in October I'd mentioned how much I liked the sound of the AURALIC room where they had paired my electronics with the YG Acoustic Carmel's. I sent a note to YG inquiring about a factory visit and they graciously allowed me to spend almost 4 hours at their facility viewing how the products are made including how each and every piece is machined on site. By every piece, I mean EVERY piece. Not only do they machine their enclosures from solid aircraft grade 6061-T6 billet and sheet stock, they also machine their own spikes, binding posts, jumpers, drivers and even the PCB used for the crossover. That's a misnomer actually because it is not a "printed" circuit board in the typical sence where the copper is etched away from the FR4 base to leave the traces on the board, YG is literally machining away the unused material as it doesn't degrade the remaining copper planes nor the trace edges. They also wind their own transformers and filter coils for the crossovers. To say that they are fanatical about vertical integration, innovation and fit & finish is an understatement.
While I was there I got to hear both the original Carmel's as well as the not yet released Carmel II's. I was sworn to secrecy in a manner similar to the first rule of Fight Club, until after the product launch at this years CES. What I heard that day was the single most impressive musical demonstration of a small(ish) speaker I have ever heard. The Carmels simply blew away any expectations I ever had about detail, resolution, clarity, soundstage, you name it. I was gob smacked. My only disappointment from that day as I drove home was the knowledge that I simply couldn't pull together the funds to have such a speaker in my home as the first generation Carmel's listed at $18,000.00 and the Carmel II's were going to hit the market priced at $24,000.00. Still, they set the bar for the type of sound I wanted out of my end game dream speaker.
Two weeks ago I got a line on a mint set of original Carmel's that a YG dealer had on consignment from a customer who wanted to trade up to the YG Sophia's. Long story short, they arrive on Tuesday.
Even though my trip this week will be a short one, I think my flight home will feel like one of the longest I've ever been on due to the anticipation. Photos and impressions will of course be posted here in short order.
Last fall I mentioned here that I had visited the YG Acoustics factory as it is only about a half hour from where I live. In my coverage of the Rocky Mountain Audio Fest in October I'd mentioned how much I liked the sound of the AURALIC room where they had paired my electronics with the YG Acoustic Carmel's. I sent a note to YG inquiring about a factory visit and they graciously allowed me to spend almost 4 hours at their facility viewing how the products are made including how each and every piece is machined on site. By every piece, I mean EVERY piece. Not only do they machine their enclosures from solid aircraft grade 6061-T6 billet and sheet stock, they also machine their own spikes, binding posts, jumpers, drivers and even the PCB used for the crossover. That's a misnomer actually because it is not a "printed" circuit board in the typical sence where the copper is etched away from the FR4 base to leave the traces on the board, YG is literally machining away the unused material as it doesn't degrade the remaining copper planes nor the trace edges. They also wind their own transformers and filter coils for the crossovers. To say that they are fanatical about vertical integration, innovation and fit & finish is an understatement.
While I was there I got to hear both the original Carmel's as well as the not yet released Carmel II's. I was sworn to secrecy in a manner similar to the first rule of Fight Club, until after the product launch at this years CES. What I heard that day was the single most impressive musical demonstration of a small(ish) speaker I have ever heard. The Carmels simply blew away any expectations I ever had about detail, resolution, clarity, soundstage, you name it. I was gob smacked. My only disappointment from that day as I drove home was the knowledge that I simply couldn't pull together the funds to have such a speaker in my home as the first generation Carmel's listed at $18,000.00 and the Carmel II's were going to hit the market priced at $24,000.00. Still, they set the bar for the type of sound I wanted out of my end game dream speaker.
Two weeks ago I got a line on a mint set of original Carmel's that a YG dealer had on consignment from a customer who wanted to trade up to the YG Sophia's. Long story short, they arrive on Tuesday.
Even though my trip this week will be a short one, I think my flight home will feel like one of the longest I've ever been on due to the anticipation. Photos and impressions will of course be posted here in short order.
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slowGEEZR
Well-known member
Most excellent, Tim!
MiTT
Super User
Dave, you and Shirley will obviously be welcome as always!
amey01
Well-known member
Congratulations! Can't wait to see pics and hear about your musings.
MiTT
Super User
YG Acoustics Carmels - First Impressions & photos
When I got home from a quick trip to Chicago this week, I had a wonderfully compact crate waiting for me in the garage. The crate was solid plywood measuring about 20" x 26" x 48", with steel banding and integral latches all around. It took me about 20 minutes to get access to the crate and pull the speakers out of the die cut packaging. These things are heavy, at about 70 lbs. each, but my adrenaline was pumping as I brought them from the garage down into my listening room.
The prior weekend I had also gone out in search of a new, more horizontal rack to house all of my equipment in one location, so everything had been set up and arranged with the speaker cables awaiting termination. Hooking them up took a LOT less time than uncrating them. I started in pretty much the same relative position as I'd set the KEF LS-50's in, but eventually brought the Carmel's slightly forward about 2" and about 1 foot wider overall. I haven't installed the spikes that fit into the speaker base just yet as I'm still tweaking final positioning. When they are in use they seem to just about disappear, but occasionally they do make their presence known. I'm at the point where I'm tweaking in fractions of an inch now, so as soon as I've got them dialed in perfectly I'll add the spikes.
The sound? I'll cut to the chase and just say that this is far and away the best HiFi setup I have ever had in my home. I feel this is my end-game system (OK, maybe a few more things here and there - are we ever really "done"?). I have finally assembled a system that is giving me the immense soundstage and midrange I loved about my CLS's, but with even more detail and precision than either the CLS's or LS-50's could muster. Listening to the Finale of the Mahler Symphony No. 6 as I type this there is an absolutely huge stage unfolding in the front of the room, and just now a thunderous crescendo punctuated by deep, tight bass drums and timpani whacks. I had to dial my REL sub way back from where I'd had it set for both the CLS's as well as the LS-50's both on the crossover point as well as the gain. Perhaps the biggest treat is the ability to hear so much detail, even better than the CLS, which was a master at pulling details out of complex passages. String sections are extracted with great precision, not just in the ability to tell violins from violas, but the ability to hear distinct individual instruments, almost as if you could count how many performers were in each chair. The tone and texture of instruments is incredibly lifelike as well. Last night I was listening to some Dead Can Dance and it struck me that what I had interpreted as synthesizers on one cut in the past were actually all acoustic instruments played over the drone of a didgeridoo that was occupying the entire width of the soundstage behind the other performers.
Thus far the only downside of this upgrade is a significant lack of sleep and a burning desire to get back into the room for more listening when I have to go to work or do my man-chores around the house!
A few obligatory shots of the new setup. More to come and I'll update the front page here as time allows.
When I got home from a quick trip to Chicago this week, I had a wonderfully compact crate waiting for me in the garage. The crate was solid plywood measuring about 20" x 26" x 48", with steel banding and integral latches all around. It took me about 20 minutes to get access to the crate and pull the speakers out of the die cut packaging. These things are heavy, at about 70 lbs. each, but my adrenaline was pumping as I brought them from the garage down into my listening room.
The prior weekend I had also gone out in search of a new, more horizontal rack to house all of my equipment in one location, so everything had been set up and arranged with the speaker cables awaiting termination. Hooking them up took a LOT less time than uncrating them. I started in pretty much the same relative position as I'd set the KEF LS-50's in, but eventually brought the Carmel's slightly forward about 2" and about 1 foot wider overall. I haven't installed the spikes that fit into the speaker base just yet as I'm still tweaking final positioning. When they are in use they seem to just about disappear, but occasionally they do make their presence known. I'm at the point where I'm tweaking in fractions of an inch now, so as soon as I've got them dialed in perfectly I'll add the spikes.
The sound? I'll cut to the chase and just say that this is far and away the best HiFi setup I have ever had in my home. I feel this is my end-game system (OK, maybe a few more things here and there - are we ever really "done"?). I have finally assembled a system that is giving me the immense soundstage and midrange I loved about my CLS's, but with even more detail and precision than either the CLS's or LS-50's could muster. Listening to the Finale of the Mahler Symphony No. 6 as I type this there is an absolutely huge stage unfolding in the front of the room, and just now a thunderous crescendo punctuated by deep, tight bass drums and timpani whacks. I had to dial my REL sub way back from where I'd had it set for both the CLS's as well as the LS-50's both on the crossover point as well as the gain. Perhaps the biggest treat is the ability to hear so much detail, even better than the CLS, which was a master at pulling details out of complex passages. String sections are extracted with great precision, not just in the ability to tell violins from violas, but the ability to hear distinct individual instruments, almost as if you could count how many performers were in each chair. The tone and texture of instruments is incredibly lifelike as well. Last night I was listening to some Dead Can Dance and it struck me that what I had interpreted as synthesizers on one cut in the past were actually all acoustic instruments played over the drone of a didgeridoo that was occupying the entire width of the soundstage behind the other performers.
Thus far the only downside of this upgrade is a significant lack of sleep and a burning desire to get back into the room for more listening when I have to go to work or do my man-chores around the house!
A few obligatory shots of the new setup. More to come and I'll update the front page here as time allows.
Attachments
User211
Well-known member
That is a cool room Tim. Hope the speakers satisfy long term.
slowGEEZR
Well-known member
Looks great! I enjoyed the Carmels when I heard them at RMAF.
amey01
Well-known member
Looks great Tim. Some brighter pics would be nice to see though.
MiTT
Super User
I didn't think the pictures were all that dark, but yes, I have my REL Stadium II tucked into the back corner. It's the same sub I've had for years. The thing I like about the REL's is that they take on the sound of your main amps by virtue of the way they hook up, and they are very, very musical. I keep mine at the point where you can't really tell that ithey're on most of the time, but when you shut it off you notice something is really missing.
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MiTT
Super User
Hmm, I guess I'm a bit of a vampire!
Sure Adam, next time I pull out the camera I'll be sure to open the blinds and turn all the lights up to full brightness. I tend to listen in a mostly dark environment. Usually I only have my Hue lights on, but even they are at a dimmed level. Do you and Dave do it with the lights on? (Listen that is).
roberto
Well-known member
Beautiful Tim, I think I am your cousin, I am a wampire, (we like the quiet at night) but do not drink blood, just good spirits! Happy listening my friend!
