ML Owner Wannabe - Recommendations Please

[floridajim]

Hello,

Have wanted Martin Logans for a while, but did not have the space. Finally got "the one who must approve everything" to agree to some rearranging and so will be able to move my system into a larger space and will have space for the Logans.

Have not yet decided which model. My system is 2 channel with a BAT VK-60 power amp. I want to stay with tubes and also with BAT, but may upgrade to the 120 watt monos (if necessay). Should I bi-amp? If so, any amp recommendations. Or should I go with one of Logan models with powered bass? If so which one?

Am really looking foward to getting a pair of MLs. It will be a fun journey for sure.

Thanks in advance for any thoughs, recommendations, or whatever.

 

[twich54]

Welcome ! First off, what's your budget ? What are your room demensions ? Do you mind buying used ?

Even with the above answered you'll get a 'basket' of replies, but this will help narrow it somewhat

 

[floridajim]

Budget & Room Size

Thanks Dave. Good questions. My budget for speakers is around $2500, but is flexible. Also normally buy pre-owned. I use the A'gon "buy and try" strategy, but like to research before any purhcase. Room size is 22 x 24 with 8' ceiling.

Thanks again,
Jim

 

[MotorToad]

I think you'd do well with Aerius i and a second amp, or Sequel II or SL3. Even if you need (or want) to get new panels you should be able to keep around that budget.

 

[twich54]

Jim, check out akm3 add in the classifieds, he has a pair of Vista's for sale@$2399 !!

 

[eknuds01]

Hello,

Have wanted Martin Logans for a while, but did not have the space. Finally got "the one who must approve everything" to agree to some rearranging and so will be able to move my system into a larger space and will have space for the Logans.

Have not yet decided which model. My system is 2 channel with a BAT VK-60 power amp. I want to stay with tubes and also with BAT, but may upgrade to the 120 watt monos (if necessay). Should I bi-amp? If so, any amp recommendations. Or should I go with one of Logan models with powered bass? If so which one?

Am really looking foward to getting a pair of MLs. It will be a fun journey for sure.

Thanks in advance for any thoughs, recommendations, or whatever.

Should you bi-amp?

You can and there are two ways to do this: passive and active bi-amping. Passive bi-amping is perhaps the most straightforward of the two. Some people like a nice solid state amp to power the woofers and another amp (usually a tube amp) to power the panels.

Active bi-amping involves disabling/bypassing the internal cross over in the speaker and then employing an external cross-over to split the signal as you see fit into the panels and woofers. Obviously this is way more involved and imparts additional costs (external cross over) and labor (open the speaker and unhooking wires).

Powered speakers from ML: either vantages or summits. You can't loose with either but Summits (even used) are perhaps out of the budget. At times you can find used Vantages for around 3-4k.

Another poster recommended the Aerius i and you could do far worse. Used they'll run about $1000-$1200 + shipping. Or you could hunt down some Aeon i, SL3, etc. All are outstanding choices.

I wouldn't bi-amp right away. Give the speakers a shot with your electronics and see how things sound before delving into more costly upgrades. If you find some used Aerius i, for $1000, say, that leaves you another $1500 for a nice sub which could re-enforce the bottom end. ML makes terrific subs as so velodyne and paradigm.

I just ran a google search on your amp and it's a 60 wpc tube amp. I know the WPC isn't the end-all-be-all and that tube amp is probably more adequate to power the panels, but I am wondering if the logans could be somewhat taxing on that amp since it'll need to power the woofers too. Plus, you have a fairly large listening room (well, bigger than my area anyway). If you want to keep that amp, and use it, another route is get the used ML speakers and invest some in a good solid state amp so you can bi-amp as per your original post. Any number of amps are available on the 'Gon. I use a Sunfire Symphonic Reference and couldn't be happier. Other great brands that are popular on this forum: BAT, Krell, Levinson, Plinius, Rotel, Anthem, etc. Again, with amps there are so many choices. Do some searching for a good, stable, SS amp. One idea is a used Rotel 1080 (usually around 7-800, used). I have auditioned that amp and the 1070 and they are very nice considering the price. If you bi-amp you'll need some extra pairs of cables and interconnects, so make you account for that too.

happy hunting!

Erik

 

[coolcobramatt]

And don't forget coolcobramatt who has a nice set of Aeon i's for sale too...lol

 

[akm3]

Yea, just to pimp my own ad, I'm selling some Vistas in your price range.

HOWEVER, I don't recommend you buy them yet. You can get a much cheaper set of Aerius or Aeon or Clarity that will let you find out cheaper (and at a more stable resale price) if you like the Martin Logan sound or not.

If you LIKE the sound, then sell those for the same price you paid for it, and upgrade to one of the newer models like my Vistas.

Or, throw caution to the wind and get a nice pair of Vistas for the price range (shipping might damage your price range)

-Allen

 

[Spike]

Your room is a bit too big for the BAT Vk60 to push, especially when it's facing the wide range of impedance posed by the Logans in full-range mode. I'm thinking that you'll need to bi-amp to get good result. The critical item to watch for when bi-amping is to match the gains of both amplifiers. For example, if you're using the tubed Vk60 for the panels and looking for a solid-state amplifier for bass, you'll need to get the gains to match. The gain for the Vk60 is 28db, so you should look for an amplifier with similar gain. The BAT Vk200 is NOT a good match with the Vk60 since it only has 25db gain. However, the BAT Vk500 is a near perfect match with 29db gain. Those are just examples to give you a ball-park figure of what you'll be looking for. Due to the high gain of the Vk60, you're looking at solid-state amplifier with nominal power rating of 200-250wpc (~28db gain typically). Another option is to lower the gain of the Vk60 by 3db which will involve a 3db attenuator in front of the Vk60. I'm NOT a fan of this option due to the fact that you're putting yet another device in the signal chain and will distort the important mids and highs. Now that we got the techno-babble out of the way, let's focus on your situation. I'd go with the Aerius i's to get the benefit of the more recent "i" panels (as opposed to SL3 or older Sequel) and a decent solid-state amplifier. Budget-wise, Aerius i's go for about $1100, and Bryston 4B ST for around $1300 (no need for SST series if you're looking at bass duty for the Bryston). Other choices are Classe' DR15 (150wpc) for around $800 on A'gon, Threshold, Proceed AMP2, Krell, etc... for around the $1200-$1500 budget. Good luck.

Spike