Denon AVR 2309CI

[Gordon Gray]

Howdy folks,

Recently installed this unit in my separate 5.1 system, which consists of 4 - B & W M-1's, a B & W XTC center channel, and a Polk Audio 12" powered sub.

What a bargain for $750 (includes $100 discount from Crutchfield).

With the Audyssey setup including the Audyssey Dynamic EQ function (which adjusts the tonal quality at low volume levels), this puppy really sings for the bucks.

It also has 4 - HDMI inputs and one output. Unit is also able to upconvert on the video side. Haven't tried this yet but this may finally push me over the edge to buy an HD Plasma assuming it will improve the video quality from standard DirectTV signals.

If anyone has any experience using this or a similar unit in this way, I'd sure appreciate some comments on the video performance side.

So if you are looking for a 100 watt X 7 AVR, I would highly recommend auditioning this unit in this price range.

GG

PS: The manual is still a disaster so some patience, in set up, is required.

 

[Audiophiliac]

I always try not to upconvert from one video type to another. Especially analog to digital. I have not been impressed while trying to upconvert from any analog format to HDMI. Even 1080i component to 1080p HDMI is iffy. And you run into bigger problems with things like Wii, PS3, VCR, etc.....I know its nice to be able to output everything on one cable and use only one input on your display, but this can lead to all kinds of issues.

 

[RUR]

Gordon, if you mean conversion of a DVD's 480p signal to, say, 1080p, you're really talking about upscaling. Be advised that any HD display will upscale internally to its native resolution - 720p or 1080p - and you'll only want to use an external upscaler if it does a better job than the one in the display (not hard to do, but an added cost).

Does upscaling make a difference in PQ? You bet it does. I'm using a Realta-based upscaler (in my Blu-ray player) and it makes standard DVD's look much better, indeed. Not as good as true 1080p high-bitrate Blu-ray, but a big improvement.

 

[C.A.P]

Gordon, I am not the HT guru but I run a HDTV and BD through it and its way better than standard DVD. The HD signal I get from my SAT is decent. Its 1080i . I do not think you can take a regular signal and up convert it like a DVD. Maybe I am missing your question ??? You need a HD signal to watch HD tv. and a HIGH DEF DVD or BD player to watch DVD. Now you can have a simple BD player that does not do all the CODECS like DTS Master Audio and Dolby True HD.The BD player will send that signal to the Reciever to be decoded and then played through the surround system. Only the upper end BD players do all codecs right now. Most will stream it to a HT reciever though.

Hope it helps !

 

[RUR]

.....I do not think you can take a regular signal and up convert it like a DVD. ....

You can, actually.:ROFL: The upscaling, whether performed in 2309 AVR or HDTV typically works on all inputs.

Need Gordon to tell us if he's describing upconversion e.g. analog in>HDMI out or upscaling e.g. 480p in>1080p out.

 

[C.A.P]

You can, actually.:ROFL: The upscaling, whether performed in 2309 AVR or HDTV typically works on all inputs.

Need Gordon to tell us if he's describing upconversion e.g. analog in>HDMI out or upscaling e.g. 480p in>1080p out.

Interesting. So you can take a 480i standard Sat. receiver and upconvert it to 1080i or 1080p picture with out a HD sat box ? DO TELL!

Sorry Gordon to hyjack your thread but I think it will apply !

 

[RUR]

CAP, you're taking the broadcast information (presumably in 480i) and using the upscaler to interpolate missing pixels. This does improve PQ, especially with a high-quality upscaler (e.g. Reon, Realta), but it's not the same as a high bitrate HD signal or Blu-ray disc.

Here's a good read on the subject: http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/features/2402/video-upconversion-facts-and-fallacies.html

/Ken

 

[Gordon Gray]

Thanks for the input guys.

I don't know much about this video issue thing and was just trying to find out from others what their experience is with this feature.

With my current Toshiba direct view TV, I connect the video feeds directly into the back of the TV and the audio feeds into the AVR.

I currently have no hardware that has a HDMI output.

Main reason for the TV upgrade would be to get rid of the "big box" and mount the TV on the wall. I have a somewhat smallish living room and mounting the TV on the wall would make a noticeable improvement.

My plan would be to get a HDTV but keep my regular (non HD) DirecTV programming. I just don't watch enough TV to justify the HD programming costs. Hence, the question about better video quality if I pass all video signals thru the AVR.

In my specific case, I would plug the S Video feed from my satellite box and the component video feed from my DVD player into the AVR and then run HDMI out from the AVR into the HDTV.

I may consider a Blu Ray player that can play regular DVD's at the same time I look at buying a new HDTV.

Gordon

 

[RUR]

I currently have no hardware that has a HDMI output.

I haven't read the manual, but the Denon should upconvert non-HDMI inputs to HDMI output to the display.

I just don't watch enough TV to justify the HD programming costs. Hence, the question about better video quality if I pass all video signals thru the AVR.

The 2309 uses a Faroudja DCDI chipset for upscaling, which is pretty decent, and you should definitely see an improvement in PQ vs. what you're using now.

 

[Gordon Gray]

Hi Ken,

That's what I needed to know.

Thank you again for your input.

Gordon

 

[RichTeer]

I may consider a Blu Ray player that can play regular DVD's at the same time I look at buying a new HDTV.

Consider away--all Blu-ray players can play DVDs! (At least, I can't think of one that doesn't.) The picture and sound quality available from Blu-ray is light years ahead of DVD (even upscaled).

 

[JMAUSGP]

Gordon,

The Denon is a very, very nice unit for the money. As others have said it will upscale the various signals but things are not always as simple as that. When you are ready to get a flat screen you really need to get a 1080P flat screen, either plasma or LCD. If you can get a HDTV with 120Htz or 240htz you will have a TV that is good for at least a few years to come. Also try to get the biggest screen size you can afford. The larger the TV the more you will appreciate 1080P. Becareful of the plasmas as many of them are still 720P and do not support 1080P. Blu-Ray will definitely not look as good on a large 720P screen as it will in 1080P.

You mentioned satellite TV and the cost to go HD, DISH Network has a 100% HD package for 29 bucks a month that your Denon will upscale from 1080i and 720P which most HD signals are currently in to the full 1080P. Watching many of the HD programs on a big flat screen will tend to change your viewing habits and many of them come in 5.1 surround sound which is nice. Dish also has 1080P Video On Demand which would look really good on a 50inch or larger flat screen. Your Denon is a very good vehicle to start exploring the current limits of HT but just like ML music systems with digital HT your system is only as strong as its weakest link. One little suggestion I would have right now would be to pick up a Oppo BDP 983 which will play Blu-Ray, and just about every other format including SACD and DVD Audio. These are a new offerring from OPPO and should be available in the next 30 to 45 days. The nice thing about the OPPO is that you could hook it up to the Denon and upscale your DVDs, play Blu-Ray, and listen to SACD and DVDA in 5.1 surround sound, all through your singe HDMI connection, very easy, simple and nice. You may find a whole other avenue to explore music wise or not but the Denon has all the music surround modes and some things like Beatles LOVE in 5.1 is incredible to experience in surround sound, not to mention movies. And by the way, your Denon supports 7.1 surround sound so you can go off in that direction as well. Bottom line, the Denon is stronger in the sound mode due to its versatility. As for PQ, 1080P only makes a big difference as your screen size gets bigger. Unlike what some people might tell you when it comes to screen size....size does matter. If you want to explore HT more go to AVS forum and cruise through some of the forums there. HT is a whole different world than 2 channel music, not necessarily better because that is subjective but it is definitely different/better.

 

[DrJRapp]

My plan would be to get a HDTV but keep my regular (non HD) DirecTV programming. I just don't watch enough TV to justify the HD programming costs. Hence, the question about better video quality if I pass all video signals thru the AVR.

Gordon

I don't believe that once you start watching HD from Bluray you will be satisfied with SD TV very long. I know that's what happened here.

I have a Denon 2307 CI (the 2007 version) in my family room and I think it is a great unit for the price. It doesn't have as many features as yours does, and only does HDMI switching well. It's upconversion and deinterlacing capabilities are weak.

I'm going to mirror everyones comments ...buy the largest 1080P monitor that you can afford. If it is an LCD Be especially dilligent about it's processing capability lower priced units look great except on fast moving objects that tend to blur due to lack of processing power.