Amp for Vista? Please help

[mikroski]

First Question
I'm considering integrated amp for Vista. My choices is
- Krell 400
- Accuphase E350
- Mcintosh 6300
- Balance Audio Technology VK300

I most listen to jazz and classic, dynamic of orchestra is a much for me. I have no chance to demo amp and speaker together (I live in Bangkok). So your experience should help me a lot for decisions.

Second Question
I have a small room for music only, size is 3 x 5 m. Is it enough for Vista?

Thank you very much
Pal.

 

[Craig]

Since you're in Bangkok you should visit the Siam Paragon Center. It is the most incredible mall I've ever seen and has at least three high end Audio stores. One focuses on Home Theater and the other two were specifically two channel audio equipment. They are on the 3rd floor near the Ferrari, Porsche and Lamborghini stores. And yes they actually had these cars in a mall store. Our malls in the US are nothing like this or at least the ones I've been to.

The audio store is one the best I've ever seen with a large selection of top of the line gear such as Sonus Faber, MBL, Accuphase, etc. The prices of some gear were below MSRP.

http://www.siamparagon.co.th/v3/index2.html

 

[mikroski]

Hi Craig,

Thanks for recommend, I already been at Paragon and audited many system there such as Totem, Sonus Faber, Klipsch, etc. Problem is ML shop is not there, so it is no way to try Accuphase, Mcintosh amp with Vista

I afraid that integrated amp in my price range will not enough for Vista, so any input shall be very appreciated.

Pal.

 

[Satch]

Mikroski,

I'm running an Ayre V-5xe two channel amp and Cary SLP 98P tubed preamp with my Vistas and Depth i. It sounds awesome to me but I haven't been able to compare it to anything else.

Satch

 

[David Matz]

Hi,

It's very hard to answer your question as there are so many variables since we are discussing personal tastes and experiential products.

The BAT integrated you mention is one of the best products in its class and price range. However, I really like the BAT sound. I own a BAT preamp and have heard other BAT products, but not the integrated you are referring to. The BAT integrated is 150 watts per channel, with an excellent preamp stage. 150 watts should be enough unless you blast it, but you may prefer more power for more control of the panel/ or maybe it's not your cup of tea. Krell is known to be more analytic sounding; you may or may not like that. I really like the Mac sound, but I don't own their products as I personally have found stuff that sounds better to my ears. Macs are known to have "mushy" midranges, but again this is a BROAD generalization and I have not heard this specific unit. You may feel differently, though.

Best of luck!

 

[twich54]

Given your small room, the 150 watt BAT is PLENTY of power for your Vista's !

Enjoy and welcome !

 

[amey01]

I'm running a Classé power amp and Copland preamp with mine. I haven't compared to anything you mention, but I have compared it to various Krell designs - unfortunately they don't do it for me (a little too detached, maybe a bit clinical).

But there are a few of us here that use Classé so try to audition their integrated as well.

Good luck - Oh, and funny story about the Siam Centre - we wanted to go there and the taxi driver refused to take us. He was just saying "no, I won't take you to the Siam Centre - I'll take you here instead". It got quite heated as we really wanted to go and he finally stopped arguing and took us. When we arrived the whole place was closed! Is it still closed on Sundays?

 

[taylode]

Since you included McIntosh I don't think you can ever go too far a field selecting Mc gear. The MA6300 is a very nice integrated amp and like all Mc gear holds it's value very well. If you budget can stand it you may want to consider either the MA6600 which has 200 watts, autoformers, and you can add the TM2 tuner module. Another to consider would be the MA2275, which is a very nice tube integrated amp.

Good luck and let us know what you end up choosing.

 

[mikroski]

Hi all, thank you very much for all of advises. Today I audited Vista with Krell 400 and CEC player. Krell and ML have the same dealer here so it is only one amp that I can try with Vista. Vista placed 1.5 m from front wall, 1 m from side wall and 2 m apart with a small toe in around 5 degree.

I play many CD jazz and classics, mid and high is very impressive, sound stage is very deep and image of each instrument is very focus. I can point out on every instruments. The problem is when I try Telarc's Great Film Fantacy track 4 "Imperial March", the timpani sound like a small drum

On Telarc's Oscar Peterson The Very Tall Band track 8 "Bass Solo Medley", double bass also sound very thin. When compare to all speakers that I audited in this price range, I sorry to say that Vista is the weakest in bass

Any how my wife said that she like sound of Vista, she do not care about bass.:bowdown:

So I have additional thing to consider, if I go with Vista I must find a sub woofer for my classical music. :think:


P.S. amey01, sorry to hear you have problem, what time you arrived Siam Center? On weekend they will open until 1000 p.m.

 

[Craig]

I find it unusual that you found the Krell to be thin with bass. Krell's are best known for their bass qualities. Lack of bass could be due to room and setup. A sub would certainly take care of any bass deficiencies if you have any in your setup.

I've owned the Krell 300iL integrated which is very similar to the 400iL and both have the same 200 watts of power. My Krell powered a pair of Odysseys with no problem. It was very detailed and clean with pretty good bass especially for an integrated. It could also play loud if but would get hot if you drove it hard for a while. If you go with the Krell be sure to have a very good sounding source component because it will be very revealing and unforgiving especially matched with ML speakers. It works best using balanced interconnects.

I haven't heard any of the other integrateds you mentioned but you might prefer their sound over the Krell although I have my doubts about them playing bass better than a Krell amp.

 

[mikroski]

Craig,

I don't think that thin bass caused by Krell but it may be limit of Vista itself. Or may be caused by over-damp of demo room, all wall and ceiling have full damping material as in picture (sorry for poor quality, i took it from my PPC).

BTW my wife already allow me to purchase Vista so let see about bass issue after it move to my house. Adding sub woofer is not a problem but the problem now is that i had audited BAT VK300 and Mcintosh 6300, 6900 many times and love its sound. It a hard decision to purchase BAT or Mc without trying with Vista.

Pal

 

[w_thongchai]

Hi from Bangkok (as well)

Sawasdee krub Khun mikroski:

I think you went to the right place for Vista auditioned -- audio excellece at SOGO. To my knowledge, they are the only authorized ML store in Thailand (i also got my Vista from them about 2 years ago). About the bass, i think ML sound might be different by design -- there's a "punch" but not the usual way of sound you normally heard from typical speakers. With proper setup, you'll be "hooked" with the clarity, sound stage depth and focus from ML's dipole design.

For Mc and BAT gear, you can visit Siam Paragon per Craig's note -- KS Sons group (www.kssons.com). They also carry MBL, PassLabs and many more gear for you to choose.

For me, I run my vista with Ayre-V3, quite a legacy amp, fine with plenty (sometime too much) bass. Not much of equipment upgrade lately -- but thinking about moving to PasLabs or Krell Amplifier + MIT Shotgun speaker cable when opty allows. Detail of my setup can be found on #185 page.

FOR THE REST OF BANGKOK EXPERIENCE: Yes, all store are open on Sunday and those Taxi driver are quite annoying!!! ha ha... ;-)

ps. I also live in Bangkok ... probably first member from Thailand in this great ML owner's club blog -- we can chat.

 

[FISH_MAN]

Good GOD is that a sales floor??? what a mess
If i was Martin logan I would pull there contract for that! or any other for that matter

 

[w_thongchai]

Good GOD is that a sales floor??? what a mess
If i was Martin logan I would pull there contract for that! or any other for that matter

ha ha... :ROFL: yes they should with that room condition. But to give the store some credit, picture shown was from their smallest "testing" room. They have some impressive audition rooms as well -- with advance reservation. http://www.audioexcellence.co.th/

 

[FISH_MAN]

yeah they probably do I guess I should lighten up

 

[mikroski]

Sawasdee krub Khun mikroski:
ps. I also live in Bangkok ... probably first member from Thailand in this great ML owner's club blog -- we can chat.

Sawasdee krub Khun Thongchai, your system look very cool.:bowdown:


After spending my weekend through this excellent website, I considering Vantage now (not audited yet). I have questions to ask you all
1. Is Vantage too big for my room (9 x 15 ft)?
2. Has it a much more bass than Vista?
3. Which is the better choice Vista plus subwoofer or Vantage?

Thanks
Pal

 

[twich54]

I have questions to ask you all

1. Is Vantage too big for my room (9 x 15 ft)?
2. Has it a much more bass than Vista?
3. Which is the better choice Vista plus subwoofer or Vantage?

1) Not if you like near-field listening

2) No

3) Vantage, given your room size, IMO, with that little space you will have plenty of bass energy, unless of course you need more ! ?

Also the Vantage besides its internal power driven bass driver, is made entirely in the US including cabinetry and cross-over network. The only thing made in the US on the Vista is the ESL panel.

 

[mikroski]

thanks twich54

I just call dealer and ask him to prepare Vantage for my audition on this Friday (I will sick leave :devil. I hope that this will be a final choice for me.

p.s. I had listened to CLX and very impressed, hope that I can afford it one day :music:

 

[w_thongchai]

mikroski:

How was your "sick leave" audition going? :ROFL: I hope that give enough sense of how would you like to invest in this fantastic speakers. Let us know hot it goes! Cheers!

 

[mikroski]

mikroski:

How was your "sick leave" audition going? :ROFL: I hope that give enough sense of how would you like to invest in this fantastic speakers. Let us know hot it goes! Cheers!

Hi Khun Thongchai

I audited Vantage with Krell 400xi yesterday. Very impressive.

Now I think I will go with Vantage, it has far more bass than Vista and suitable for classical music (in my opinion). But I don't like Krell 400xi sound (I had audited them many time with various speakers). I consider NAD M3 or Mcintosh 6900 or Accuphase 350 for Vantage.

I already have SACD Player Marantz SA15S1, plan to purchase Vantage after I move into new house in January. So I still have time to find the integrated amp. Appreciate for any suggestion.

Thanks,
Pal