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Power Conditioners, Voltage Stabilizers, etc.

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congers

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I would like to take this opportunity to thank the regular contributors for their responses to my prior questions. Based on your feedback, I have auditioned and bought Conrad Johnson and Audio Quest produts that have really complimented my Aeon I's.

My next questions is in regards to the above topic.

I am currently utilizng a Monster HTS5100 Power Conditioner.
I live in a Condo Complex with about 50 units and a shared Main Power feed to all the units.

We are subject to occasional blackouts and I have noticed on the Monster that the Power Regulator on the Monster varies between 118 and 125.

My questions are as follows:
What are the major benefits of these two units.
If you have a Power Conditioner is a voltage regulator helpful

From a quality perspective I am looking for as neutral a unit as possible. I have read that some units tend to color the sound (bright or dark).

Now that I have thrown this out at the team, does it make sense to purchase a voltage regulator? Does it make any sense to upgrade the Monster 5100.

And finally - any recommendations on units that blend well with Martin Logans.

I know these questions are rather open ended and basic, but I am not an expert in this area.

Thanks again for the advice.

Mike
 

Anthony A.

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i would sell the monster conditioner and buy a voltage stabilizer + a balanced power conditioner. bpt makes a great product for this as does blue circle. as for voltage stabilizers, just run a search on yahoo and you'll find tons of them available that will fit your need.
 

DTB300

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congers said:
We are subject to occasional blackouts and I have noticed on the Monster that the Power Regulator on the Monster varies between 118 and 125.
These are normal voltage swings in a home. If you notice on some equipment it will state something like 120V +-8% or something like that. Most if not all electrical components and applicances will operate just fine in your range.

The best thing for voltage regulation and clean power is a Regenerator. It will take the power coming in and put out a brand new signal. Not a clean up or filter but a regeneration. While some of these are expensive, it is the best way to go. I see Panamax now offers one (5500) that you can get for around $600, but I have not read or heard anything about the unit to know how good or bad it is.

Balanced power as noted by Anthony is another option and the company he pointed out, BPT is highly regarded.

Monster Power units are introductory type devices, but unfortunately they charge a lot of money for what you get. But they will also give you the feel of what power conditioning/filterin can do for you. Remember with this unit it is just the tip of the iceberg on power conditioning, filtering and regeneration.

Dan
 

aliveatfive

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Moster makes a voltage stabilizer (the AVS 2000) which I find quite satisfactory. I use it because I find that tubes are more prone to the ill effects of an over-voltage condition. For my purposes, it does the job.
 

Reverb

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aliveatfive said:
Moster makes a voltage stabilizer (the AVS 2000) which I find quite satisfactory. I use it because I find that tubes are more prone to the ill effects of an over-voltage condition. For my purposes, it does the job.

It's junk.

The problem with it is its slow, loud and not accurate. If you have noticed the gauge on the front tells you plus or negative power, that gauge is saying how much power the stabilizer is having to add to make your power 120volts. In a lot of way your voltage swings have greatly increased with the AVS2000 because of the shifting power coming out of your house this thing cant keep up with and its dancing the power back and forth trying to keep it at 120volts. I would rater throw my equipment off a roof then put it threw that mess. Most feel the way this thing consistently shift the power may shorten the lifer more then if you left it plugged directly into the wall.


Power regeneration is the best way to go, but you have to be careful with it. Most regenerators have a limit, a max amount of power they can output. You need to match the regenerator to your system, get one that can output the power your system needs. Ps Audio makes some of the best regenerators in the world; also I hear Audiophile APS makes good stuff.
 

MarkNewbie

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Zip3kx07 said:
Power regeneration is the best way to go, but you have to be careful with it. Most regenerators have a limit, a max amount of power they can output. You need to match the regenerator to your system, get one that can output the power your system needs. Ps Audio makes some of the best regenerators in the world; also I hear Audiophile APS makes good stuff.
Joe,

I travel during the week almost every week so I unplug my stuff when I leave for a business trip. I actually run in the house and plug everything back in and power it all up before I even take my suitcase out of the car! I am normally gone for 2-3 nights during the week so I don't want to chance a lightening strike while I am gone. I have thought about some kind of surge protection and then leaving everything on while I am gone. Will a "regenerator" also serve to protect my equipment from lightening strikes? Or is there something else I should look into purchasing?
Mark
 

DTB300

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MarkNewbie said:
I have thought about some kind of surge protection.....
Brick-Wall or Zero Surge (same product) - Not MOV based. One of the better Surge protectors out there.

The best surge protection is unplugging the unit :)

Dan
 

MarkNewbie

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DTB300 said:
Brick-Wall or Zero Surge (same product) - Not MOV based. One of the better Surge protectors out there.

The best surge protection is unplugging the unit :)

Dan
Dan,

I think it was something that you said before in another post that made me start unplugging everything when I leave on a trip. Then I read the post about it being best to leave everything on. I am running some tube gear. I leave it on when I am at home and that is provided that there are not thunderstorms in the forecast. Problem is that as soon as I walk in the door, I want to start listening to music. The stereo systems in today's Rental fleet just doesn't cut it! Nor does the one in my company car! So I would like to be able to leave the system on when I am gone so it is ready to go when I get home. Now if the advice here is not to leave it on even with "surge protection", then I will follow that advice because you folks know much more about this stuff than I do.

Mark
 

DTB300

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MarkNewbie said:
I think it was something that you said before in another post that made me start unplugging everything when I leave on a trip. Then I read the post about it being best to leave everything on.
For my equipment...when we are going to be gone for many days, I unplug speakers and turn off my stuff. But otherwise, I leave everything on all the time, or in standby mode if the unit offers it.

I realize that when you come home and turn stuff on, it takes some time for equipment to come back to that point of nirvana. But one must consider where you live, how frequent and intense storms are (lightning strikes), and how lucky do you feel? :)

Dan
 

Kruppy

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PS Audio

I have to agree with Zip on the PS Audio stuff.

While not having any experience with their Power Plants (regenerators), I have a Power Director 3.5, which is basically a couple of ultimate outlets with multiple layers of surge protection (MOVs are either the 2nd or 3rd level of protection). After installing it in my system, I noticed a definite improvement in sound quality with a lower noise floor. I've been very happy with it. They also have a 30 day pretty much no questions asked return policy. In addition Paul McGowan (owner) is easily accessible from the PS Audio customer support page. Be prepared to spend some cash if you go this way, cause their stuff ain't cheap.

You may want to post some questions on the PS Audio Power forum on AudioAsylum or directly on the PS Audio site. Paul will personally answer questions.
 
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Reverb

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MarkNewbie said:
Joe,

I travel during the week almost every week so I unplug my stuff when I leave for a business trip. I actually run in the house and plug everything back in and power it all up before I even take my suitcase out of the car! I am normally gone for 2-3 nights during the week so I don't want to chance a lightening strike while I am gone. I have thought about some kind of surge protection and then leaving everything on while I am gone. Will a "regenerator" also serve to protect my equipment from lightening strikes? Or is there something else I should look into purchasing?
Mark
It depends on what regenerator you go with if it has surge suppression or not. I know monsters AVS2000 power stabilizer does not offer any surge suppression; all of PS Audio’s power products have protection. But I don’t think there is any product on the market then is going to stop a lighting strike, I think the best way to stop a lighting strike is still to unplug your gear.
 

Reverb

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Kruppy said:
I have to agree with Zip on the PS Audio stuff.

While not having any experience with their Power Plants (regenerators), I have a Power Director 3.5, which is basically a couple of ultimate outlets with multiple layers of surge protection (MOVs are either the 2nd or 3rd level of protection). After installing it in my system, I noticed a definite improvement in sound quality with a lower noise floor. I've been very happy with it. They also have a 30 day pretty much no questions asked return policy. In addition Paul McGowan (owner) is easily accessible from the PS Audio customer support page. Be prepared to spend some cash if you go this way, cause their stuff ain't cheap.

You may want to post some questions on the PS Audio Power forum on AudioAsylum or directly on the PS Audio site. Paul will personally answer questions.

I have a HTPS-7000ss from monster and a PS Audio Xstream Ultimate power cable, its basicly a statment power cable with built in ultimate outlet. The cable offers up to 40 Db of noise reduction twice that of monster. The Ps Audio has a mush more refined natural sound compared to monsters cable's. I like Ps audio power products. I will be getting more soon, they make good stuff.
 
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MarkNewbie

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Joe and Dan,

You two always seem to give great advice so I am going to continue to unplug my stuff each week when I leave for a business trip. Indiana has some pretty unpredictable weather. Thunder and lightening is not unusual and I have seen baseball size hail on more than one occasion. My last house has a new roof as a result! I think I'll start saving for the regenerator. How much am I looking at spending here?

Mark
 

DTB300

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MarkNewbie said:
Joe and Dan, You two always seem to give great advice
Good to hear my advice helps out....

I think I'll start saving for the regenerator. How much am I looking at spending here?
Depends on how much power you need it to regenerate....I have seen them for under $1000 and I have seen them for Thousands. Personally I have not shopped intently for them, doing a bunch of research, asking questions, and learning about them, so I cannot be of much help other than what prices I have seen.

Like Joe...the PS Audio Regenerators get some great talk on other sites that I visit and PS Audio would probably be a good starting place and then look what else is out there and compare. Ask, ask, ask, ask and learn.

Dan
 

Reverb

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Power regeneration is the holy grail of power conditioning. A conditioner will try to clean the power by taking some noise off the line but will do nothing to repair a broken sine wave. Power stabilizers will try to stabilize the uneven power by adding and subtracting to make it consistent 120V and will do nothing to fix a sine wave. A good regenerator on the other hand will take the AC out of the wall convert it to DC and then back to AC. It’s when it converts the power back to AC that it cleans the power, the regenerator turn the DC to AC with out all the noise and power spikes on the line. What you gat is very clean regenerated power. In Ps Audio’s case there regenerators go one step further by regenerating its own sine wave from scratch, this sine wave can be tailored to your system for the best possible performance. I don’t think any other Regenerator on the market makes its own sine wave from scratch.

One thing to watch out for is current limitation; you want to make sure your regenerator has enough head room to allow your system to extend and on fall flat on it’s face because it cant get the power it needs. Audiophile APS makes a regenerator that looks good on paper and is getting good reviews, but I have not personally tried one yet. The APS non-current limiting and does not make a new sine wave but rebuilds a 60Hz sine wave from the wall out let.

There are lots of options out there, ask lots of question do your home work and audition as many different power products as you can, to fine the one that best fits your system.

I hope this helps, Good luck
 

DTB300

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MarkNewbie said:
I think I'll start saving for the regenerator. How much am I looking at spending here?
From PS Audio Site (MSRP) and Audiogon (used):

P1000: 1000 Watts - $3500 Audiogon - $2300
P500: 500 Watts - $2200 Audiogon - $1400
P300: 300 Watts - $1500 Audiogon - $700

All depends on how much wattage you need to support.

Dan
 

Kruppy

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You can also find a P1200 and P600, however, I don't think either are currently in production. From what I understand the P1000 has some advantages (or is more current) than the P1200 design.

There's a P 500 on Ebay that started at $700 that did not have any bids on it yet the last time I checked last night. I've also seen AudioAdvisor with open box P 500s about $1400.
 

Reverb

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The P1000 replaced the P1200, and the P500 replace the P600.

The new units are much improved over the discontinued models. The p500 is a quarter the sized of the P600 with a hundred less watts, but now you have a cooling fan for that small chassis. The P1000 is passive cooling, no fan.

The P1000/500 have new multiwave II setting the older models did not have, also the power meter is much more accurate then previous designs. All new powerplants now come with Multiwave II+ for no extra coast. If you buy a powerplant that does not have MultiWave II+ you can add it for a $100.
 

congers

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Subwoofer Question

Thanks for the feedback.

My Amp is 120 Watts Per side and I have a 300 Watt Sub Woofer.
Is there any real need to run the subwoofer through a Voltage Stabilizer.

Thanks

Mike
 

DTB300

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congers said:
My Amp is 120 Watts Per side and I have a 300 Watt Sub Woofer. Is there any real need to run the subwoofer through a Voltage Stabilizer.
I think you are talking power output. You need to find out power consumption to make sure you have the right unit if considering power regeneration.

Dan
 
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