Check out the new python thick mains cables

[Dan Osib]

You had the technical supervisor for Cardas on the phone . . . why didn't you ask him? (Instead of just wasting his time asking for measurements on a cable you probably had no intention of buying because it is too expensive for your tastes).

I'm sure you are right. Cardas and Harmonic Tech are lying about the gauge of their cables, and some unknown guy from China selling knockoffs on ebay is being absolutely honest. You probably have found the deal of the century here. Carry on.

So you reckon I was wasting Brians time at Cardas eh Rich!!?? You are very pretty insulting for a know it all Rich. Who do you think your talking to eh Rich?? I'm getting pretty fed up with your manner which has been unnecessarily patronising from an early point instead of being helpful and friendly. I've been chucking out people like you from the nightclubs I've been working for as a doorman for the past 10 years now. Lets get one thing clear here The Cardas cable would have worked out to be exactly the same price as these Chinese cables so there would have been no problem of me affording them in this case. I spoke to Cardas well before the Chinese cables. But I'm surprised you didn't know that anyway Rich being the type of guy you are. You obviously couldn't grasp my last message to you about the gauge. Let's explain again - measuring the thickness of the bare copper with a micrometer doesn't necessarily tell you the gauge of cable which usually works out different. I explained how this works in my last message but I'm surprised you didn't understand it this time Rich. So how am I insinuating that Cardas and Harmonic are lying about their cables when I never even suggested that in the first place?

 

[Dan Osib]

Anyway I've just received a full refund from the Chinese seller so it looks like I'm going to go ahead with the purchase from Cardas now, so I wasn't wasting their time was I.

 

[Bernard]

Which Cardas cable is that? I'm surprised that it is so cheap.

 

[Dan Osib]

Which Cardas cable is that? I'm surprised that it is so cheap.

Cardas chassis cable, 15 foot ($52.00) from SonicCraft for a simple DIY platted mains cable. Anything wrong with that? Cardas sell plenty of this stuff for use in DIY mains cables. I can't understand why someone who is simply trying to save a few dollars on some mains cables is getting such a hard time here. After all it's just the mains cable, area nothing else. OK I admit I made a mistake with the Chinese mains cable, anyway I've received a full refund for them now. Everybody makes mistakes.

 

[Bernard]

Cardas chassis cable, 15 foot ($52.00) from SonicCraft for a simple DIY platted mains cable. Anything wrong with that? Cardas sell plenty of this stuff for use in DIY mains cables. I can't understand why someone who is simply trying to save a few dollars on some mains cables is getting such a hard time here. After all it's just the mains cable, area nothing else. OK I admit I made a mistake with the Chinese mains cable, anyway I've received a full refund for them now. Everybody makes mistakes.

I'm not giving you a hard time, just wondered about which cable in particular it was. I looked at the price of some Cardas power cords way back when and found them to be too expensive for me, so was wondering which one was going so cheap.

If you look back at your other thread you will see that I was the one who tried to do a sanity reset on the discussion as it quickly veered to the most expensive Nordosts.

 

[Dan Osib]

I'm not giving you a hard time, just wondered about which cable in particular it was. I looked at the price of some Cardas power cords way back when and found them to be too expensive for me, so was wondering which one was going so cheap.

If you look back at your other thread you will see that I was the one who tried to do a sanity reset on the discussion as it quickly veered to the most expensive Nordosts.

Well the Cardas chassis cable for use inside high power amplifiers and other equipment is sold by the foot. It comes in lots of different gauges up to 9.5 AWG. $3.50 per foot from SonicCraft http://www.soniccraft.com/products/wire/chassis/cardas.htm. According to the guys at Cardas it's exactly the same copper they use in their top mains cables. It can easily handle up to 250 to 450 Volts. It would be interesting to hear what a DIY mains cable would sound like using this stuff.

 

[Bernard]

Well the Cardas chassis cable for use inside high power amplifiers and other equipment is sold by the foot. It comes in lots of different gauges up to 9.5 AWG. $3.50 per foot from SonicCraft http://www.soniccraft.com/products/wire/chassis/cardas.htm. According to the guys at Cardas it's exactly the same copper they use in their top mains cables. It can easily handle up to 250 to 450 Volts. It would be interesting to hear what a DIY mains cable would sound like using this stuff.

Thanks for the info. I should get a length of the stuff to try it out. I have a couple of Furutech connectors on some plain cable that I could use.

 

[Dan Osib]

Thanks for the info. I should get a length of the stuff to try it out. I have a couple of Furutech connectors on some plain cable that I could use.

Below I've attached a photo of one of my retired electrical engineer friends' DIY hi-fi mains cables that he makes and sells to the public. I've took it appart for you to see. You need to remember to platte the 3 cables just like in the photo below. This will allow the cable to reject RF interference and also it's beneficial in other ways. Apparently the optimal length should be 5 foot and no more. The black plastic curled up tubing in the photo is the industrial sleeve which you should use to cover the platted cables. I reckon I'm going to copy this design using the Cardas copper chassis wire. I'll also be wrapping it in copper or aluminium RF shielding foil to completely block out the RF interference. Unfortunately all types of RF shielding are supposed to sit on the sound a bit, that's why a few cable makers do without it in their designs.

 

[Rich]

Anything wrong with that? . . . I can't understand why someone who is simply trying to save a few dollars on some mains cables is getting such a hard time here.

That's quite a chip on your shoulder, eh Dan? The reason you are "getting such a hard time" is that it seemed obvious that you were making a very bad decision, and the more I tried to show you reasons why it might in fact be a bad decision, the more you tried to defend your decision to purchase them. Nothing wrong with trying to save a few dollars. What was wrong, in my mind anyway, was the way you were going about trying to do it. It had all the earmarks of a scam and you just didn't want to believe that. So you spent most of the thread trying to prove why these cables were going to be so great. And in the process, you were just giving this scammer lots of free advertising on this forum.

After all it's just the mains cable, area nothing else. OK I admit I made a mistake with the Chinese mains cable, anyway I've received a full refund for them now. Everybody makes mistakes.

So why are you so upset with me? I tried to point you in the right direction from the beginning. But you just kept trying to prove why you were getting such a great deal. As for my tone being patronizing, it didn't start off that way. A little humility on your part might have helped.

You obviously couldn't grasp my last message to you about the gauge. Let's explain again - measuring the thickness of the bare copper with a micrometer doesn't necessarily tell you the gauge of cable which usually works out different.

Really? Well then why did you post this comment:

The seller of this mains cable I've just bought has emailed me this photo which actually shows the thickness of the bare copper strands being measured with a micrometer. As you can see 2.93mm diameter which definitely coresponds to 9 AWG/Gauge.

In your first post, you say that these cables "use nice thick 9 AWG (gauge) cable." Then you post the picture and say the measurement shows it "definitely corresponds to 9 gauge." Then when I point out the HT AC-11 cable is actually 11 gauge, you backtrack and say that measuring the bare copper wire doesn't necessarily tell you the gauge. Now you insinuate that I'm the one who doesn't know what I'm talking about.

I explained how this works in my last message but I'm surprised you didn't understand it this time Rich.

No, you didn't really explain anything in that post. You asked me to explain it for you.

Just out of curiosity, why did you end up getting a refund on your order? You kept shooting down every reason I gave you that this guy was scamming you. What finally made you decide otherwise?

 

[robertawillisjr]

No offence intended but are you by chance a politician or work for the government? Plenty of people out there have intentionally bought the odd one or two immitation product during their lives. I bet even you have too over the years. Thousands and thousands of people own chinese immitation IEC plugs whilst knowing they are fakes. People can't afford to pay exorbitant rip off prices for products that cost pennies to make and sell for nearly hundreds of dollars, but that's life and nobody nor I nor you can change it. Quote: 'We certainly disagree here' yeah right, I bet plenty of members here intentionally own some degree of fake product of some kind, something like an immitation Rolex for example. Unfortunately not everyone is as lawbiding as yourself here. Not everyone is an angel. As for safety issues I've had a good look over the net and so far haven't heard of anybobody having problems with their copy Oyaide IEC plugs as of yet but I'm still keeping my eyes peeled. As I already stated, anything electrical I buy over the net I pass onto my friend (ex electrical engineer) for proper equipment testing if there is the possibility that it is suspect. I'm not promoting the immitation world, I'm just informing you of the way that it is at the moment.

Well we do disagree. You are correct in that many (most) people buy knock offs. That still doesn't make it right. There are a good number of small businesses that have gone under as a result. There are also millions of people working in sweat shops and under dangerous conditions to provide us with these products.

You can rationalize your position but wrong is wrong. I admit that it is tempting, because the prices for legitimate audio products are too high but since I don't want people to steal from me, I don't steal from them. By the way, do you also buy or download bootleg music?

I wish I were an angel, then I wouldn't have to worry about this painful bursitis. Oh I am not in the government (although I spent 20 years as an AF avionics technician), I teach computer science at Hampton University for the past 25 years.

 

[Bernard]

I'm not trying to bust anyone's chops here, but was wondering what would happen insurance-wise if a home-made power cord was the cause of a fire; it could happen. Someone raised a question in one of the previous pages about whether a cable was UL-approved, and that's what got me thinking about it.

 

[Hocky]

I'm not trying to bust anyone's chops here, but was wondering what would happen insurance-wise if a home-made power cord was the cause of a fire; it could happen. Someone raised a question in one of the previous pages about whether a cable was UL-approved, and that's what got me thinking about it.

I think they would pay for it. A salt water fish tank friend of mine had a power cord hung incorrectly without a drip loop that allowed water onto the outlet, shorted out a circuit, started a fire, and broke the tank to fill the house with hundreds of gallons of salt water on top of the fire damage. They didn't give him a hard time.

 

[DTB300]

If you were already thinking of dropping $500 on PC's, why not stop by Music Direct and pick up 5 of the new Shunyata Venom 3 PC for $99 each. Music Direct offers a 30 day return if not satisfied. The Venom's are a nice step up from stock cords, and IMO beat anything in their price range and up to 2x their cost.

Caelin Gabriel of Shunyata "WANTS" end users to try multiple power cords in their setup to see what change/improvment/etc happens over stock cords. He wants you to be able to try them, but also be able to return them if not happy. And I agree - one Power Cord does not show you much in the way of the improvements they can give you. It is always better to have multiple cords in the setup, instead of just one for the same $$$$ outlay.

And, check Audiogon for Shunyata's. They are sold as fast as they are posted, whereas other brands seem to sit for days and weeks.

 

[Dan Osib]

That's quite a chip on your shoulder, eh Dan? The reason you are "getting such a hard time" is that it seemed obvious that you were making a very bad decision, and the more I tried to show you reasons why it might in fact be a bad decision, the more you tried to defend your decision to purchase them. Nothing wrong with trying to save a few dollars. What was wrong, in my mind anyway, was the way you were going about trying to do it. It had all the earmarks of a scam and you just didn't want to believe that. So you spent most of the thread trying to prove why these cables were going to be so great. And in the process, you were just giving this scammer lots of free advertising on this forum.



So why are you so upset with me? I tried to point you in the right direction from the beginning. But you just kept trying to prove why you were getting such a great deal. As for my tone being patronizing, it didn't start off that way. A little humility on your part might have helped.



Really? Well then why did you post this comment:



In your first post, you say that these cables "use nice thick 9 AWG (gauge) cable." Then you post the picture and say the measurement shows it "definitely corresponds to 9 gauge." Then when I point out the HT AC-11 cable is actually 11 gauge, you backtrack and say that measuring the bare copper wire doesn't necessarily tell you the gauge. Now you insinuate that I'm the one who doesn't know what I'm talking about.



No, you didn't really explain anything in that post. You asked me to explain it for you.

Just out of curiosity, why did you end up getting a refund on your order? You kept shooting down every reason I gave you that this guy was scamming you. What finally made you decide otherwise?

Rich why do we have to rehash this subject? It was a bad decision that I never went through with. Full refund received this morning, case closed. Or do you want to carry on dragging this on? I personally want to move on and I hope you also want to do the same thing. As for the gauge issue I'm definitely correct here when I say that just by measuring the bare copper with a micrometer doesn't necessarily tell you the actual gauge of the cable, otherwise Cardas 9.5 Gauge chassis cable would measure 2.7mm diameter with a micrometer (2.7mm dia = 9.5 Gauge), and as I've already stated it actually measures 3.71mm diameter when you check it with a micrometer (bare copper minus jack). 3.71mm diameter should equate to 6.5 GAUGE. Apparently this has got something to do with gaps between each individual strand of copper which can make the cable look thicker than it is. This is a fact. Check it out for yourself. Making A55HOLE insinuations like 'I don't know what I'm talkin about' isn't helping here Rich is it? Now I personally want to put all this behind me and get on with my life as you should be wanting to do also. Do you want to end this negative discussion and start on something more productive or would you like to drag this boring subject on? I would prefer some encouragement and friendly helpful advice now if possible. Oh by the way the reason I was given a refund was because I raised the issue of whether or not his cable was authentic Harmonic Technologies. This question triggered him to automatically refund me the full amount.

 

[Dan Osib]

If you were already thinking of dropping $500 on PC's, why not stop by Music Direct and pick up 5 of the new Shunyata Venom 3 PC for $99 each. Music Direct offers a 30 day return if not satisfied. The Venom's are a nice step up from stock cords, and IMO beat anything in their price range and up to 2x their cost.

Caelin Gabriel of Shunyata "WANTS" end users to try multiple power cords in their setup to see what change/improvment/etc happens over stock cords. He wants you to be able to try them, but also be able to return them if not happy. And I agree - one Power Cord does not show you much in the way of the improvements they can give you. It is always better to have multiple cords in the setup, instead of just one for the same $$$$ outlay.

And, check Audiogon for Shunyata's. They are sold as fast as they are posted, whereas other brands seem to sit for days and weeks.

Cheers for that advice I'll look into it.

 

[User211]

Gulp.

If mains cables are this much hassle, I'm sticking to my stock ones!

In some sense, though, this thread has done well NOT to receive some ridicule from the non-believers camp.

 

[Rich]

I would prefer some encouragement and friendly helpful advice now if possible.

OK. I encourage you (again) to check out Signal Cable. Also, I encourage you to check out Dan's suggestions about Shunyata, and Robert and Gordon's suggestions for DH Labs.

 

[Dan Osib]

OK. I encourage you (again) to check out Signal Cable. Also, I encourage you to check out Dan's suggestions about Shunyata, and Robert and Gordon's suggestions for DH Labs.

OK thanks for that. Just had a look on the DH Labs website, their RED WAVE model certainly looks like a serious piece of kit, good looking too.

 

[amey01]

If you look back at your other thread you will see that I was the one who tried to do a sanity reset on the discussion as it quickly veered to the most expensive Nordosts.

I did that, and I did so because of the title of the thread.

I quote - "Very best/finest mains cable on the planet?".

That's not unreasonable, is it?

 

[amey01]

Gulp.

If mains cables are this much hassle, I'm sticking to my stock ones!

In some sense, though, this thread has done well NOT to receive some ridicule from the non-believers camp.

+1 there Justin!!

Next time I have this much time, money and effort to invest, I'll be putting it into an upgraded DAC........I know who'll get the better improvement in sound quality!