ESL - endless need of panel replacements

[guynemer]

Hello. I live in South East Asia, and own a pair of ESL.

The speakers are now 8 years old.
In that timeframe I have already changes the panels twice, going to a third time, as large chunks of each panel are not playing anymore.


Is it expected to require such frequent replacements?

The sound is bliss but damn the panels issues is so annoying.

 

[JonFo]

Is it expected to require such frequent replacements?

No, not at all. They should last 10 to 15 years minimum. I have a set of 30-year-old ones that still work well enough as my rear speakers.

So I'd look at environmental variances to explain why you seem to develop issues sooner.
For one, humidity is not an ESL friend, as they prefer to operate at humidity levels below 60%. The Philippines is humid, and even with AC running, interior humidity might be high enough that there is micro-arcing between stators and diaphragm. Arcing will for sure shorten the lifespan of the panel.

Also, exposure to sunlight will degrade the diaphragm much quicker, so if they are in a brightly lit room, or worse, get direct sunlight for some period during the day, that could explain some of the problems.

Tell us more about the space they are deployed in.

 

[Robert D]

Yeah, thats nuts. Most panels last about 15 years at least. Is your home air conditioned? A good air cleaner would help too, to keep down air particles that will deposit on the panels. Youre the first person ive heard of that has had to replace the panels so frequently. There is another member on here that lives in your area of the world and he had problems too if i remember right. His panels went out fairly early but I dont think as early as yours.

 

[guynemer]

No, not at all. They should last 10 to 15 years minimum. I have a set of 30-year-old ones that still work well enough as my rear speakers.

So I'd look at environmental variances to explain why you seem to develop issues sooner.
For one, humidity is not an ESL friend, as they prefer to operate at humidity levels below 60%. The Philippines is humid, and even with AC running, interior humidity might be high enough that there is micro-arcing between stators and diaphragm. Arcing will for sure shorten the lifespan of the panel.

Also, exposure to sunlight will degrade the diaphragm much quicker, so if they are in a brightly lit room, or worse, get direct sunlight for some period during the day, that could explain some of the problems.

Tell us more about the space they are deployed in.

Humidity, this is out of my control, as mentioned I am in the PH.
I can't possibly run them under 24/7 Air con

For the rest, they are not at all in direct sunlight. Curtains everywhere, I rely on artificial light only. Hardly super lit room.


At the moment, my left side speakers has about 1-2 dead zones, so roughly 80% of the panel is playing.
On the right side though....only the very top zone it playing, and the very bottom is producing buzzing noises, the whooole section in between doesn't play at all

So you can imagine how muffled the sound feels.

What are my options to bring the panels back to life ? I saw on YT that people actually washed their panels with open water. Never expected that.
Would that solve my dead zones issues ?

 

[guynemer]

Yeah, thats nuts. Most panels last about 15 years at least. Is your home air conditioned? A good air cleaner would help too, to keep down air particles that will deposit on the panels. Youre the first person ive heard of that has had to replace the panels so frequently. There is another member on here that lives in your area of the world and he had problems too if i remember right. His panels went out fairly early but I dont think as early as yours.

Interesting, Probably you don't remember his name, right ?

Like I mentioned, running air con 24/7 could not be an option

 

[twich54]

next to widely varying humidity / temp an overly dusty environment is a no-no as well.
IMO, if these two conditions can't be kept under control time to move on to some other speaker .........

 

[Robert D]

Interesting, Probably you don't remember his name, right ?

Like I mentioned, running air con 24/7 could not be an option

Why not run air conditioning 24/7? Too costly there? Like Twich said, you're best off going to a traditional speaker. Have you had issues with other electronics? High humidity is bad for all electronics.

 

[Robert D]

Interesting, Probably you don't remember his name, right ?

Like I mentioned, running air con 24/7 could not be an option

Yeah, I can't remember the name. The more I think about it, the member may live in India.

 

[Rehan Azim Hashmi]

Hello. I live in South East Asia, and own a pair of ESL.

The speakers are now 8 years old.
In that timeframe I have already changes the panels twice, going to a third time, as large chunks of each panel are not playing anymore.


Is it expected to require such frequent replacements?

The sound is bliss but damn the panels issues is so annoying.

Limit dust accumulation.

Vacuum clean electrostatic panel. Frequency proportional to dust accumulation in room.

Limit amount of dust by very infrequently opening window and open door only when enter or exit room.

In addition when ELS is not in use single thick fabric cover or 2 less thick fabric cover.

I implement the above however something I not do for ELS 9, when not in use is to cover with polythene. Polythene cover not allow any dust to enter.

Limit impact of humidity.

In addition to above, except vacuum clean, operate air conditioner 5 to 10 minutes prior to removing cover on ELS. Keep operating the air conditioner throughout period listen to music.

Finally place ELS inside the house in a room that is faraway from possible source of humidity e.g kitchen etc.

 

[Robert D]

Limit dust accumulation.

Vacuum clean electrostatic panel. Frequency proportional to dust accumulation in room.

Limit amount of dust by very infrequently opening window and open door only when enter or exit room.

In addition when ELS is not in use single thick fabric cover or 2 less thick fabric cover.

I implement the above however something I not do for ELS 9, when not in use is to cover with polythene. Polythene cover not allow any dust to enter.

Limit impact of humidity.

In addition to above, except vacuum clean, operate air conditioner 5 to 10 minutes prior to removing cover on ELS. Keep operating the air conditioner throughout period listen to music.

Finally place ELS inside the house in a room that is faraway from possible source of humidity e.g kitchen etc.

Pretty sure this our member I was thinking of! In Pakistan. Perhaps similar climate?

 

[Rehan Azim Hashmi]

Pretty sure this our member I was thinking of! In Pakistan. Perhaps similar climate?

Climate not similar if not mistaken. Rains frequently there. Does not rain frequently in Karachi.

In Karachi all of 2023 unlike some of the preceding years with excessive rainfall and concomitant destruction, light rain fell for short period approx. on 3 to 5 days.

Due to the widespread destruction caused by the elements perhaps most people prayed for less rainfall in future years. Namely, 2023 and beyond.

Climate changes when travel from the South ( coast, Karachi ) towards the North ( Himalayas). Viz. temperature falls and rains more often with snow fall and sub zero temperatures over the mountainous region.

 

[guynemer]

Why not run air conditioning 24/7? Too costly there? Like Twich said, you're best off going to a traditional speaker. Have you had issues with other electronics? High humidity is bad for all electronics.

Nope, no issue with other electronics.
Cost would be a major issue yeah

 

[guynemer]

Is there any viable solution to restore the dead zones of the panel ?

 

[Nuri58]

If you live in Manila or any other major city there you have loads of slimy/sticky diesel exhaust from in particluaty jeepnes, busses and trucks. Even though I had my widows closed 24/7 the fan needed cleaning virtually daily when i lived in Makati. Maybe the washing will help in such case. I'd try it - can't make things worse. Aircon, 24/7 - have you heard about global warming?

 

[Robert D]

If you live in Manila or any other major city there you have loads of slimy/sticky diesel exhaust from in particluaty jeepnes, busses and trucks. Even though I had my widows closed 24/7 the fan needed cleaning virtually daily when i lived in Makati. Maybe the washing will help in such case. I'd try it - can't make things worse. Aircon, 24/7 - have you heard about global warming?

We run our AC 24/7 here in the US. I turn on our central air in the spring around April and don't turn it off until sometime in November.

 

[gvera]

I live in Montevideo, Uruguay.
We don't have a hot climate, but humidity is always high, 80-100% is common, never had problem with panels.
The air here is quite clean though, very little polution and I vaccum the panels every 45 - 60 days.
It's probably a combination of humidity and polution what's damaging the panels.
Avoid smoking in the music room, tobacco smoke is specially bad.

Owned Odysseys for 15 years and now Montis (built in 2016), only problem was woofer in the Odysseys that last only a week when I bought them, replaced under warranty.

 

[Robert D]

I live in Montevideo, Uruguay.
We don't have a hot climate, but humidity is always high, 80-100% is common, never had problem with panels.
The air here is quite clean though, very little polution and I vaccum the panels every 45 - 60 days.
It's probably a combination of humidity and polution what's damaging the panels.
Avoid smoking in the music room, tobacco smoke is specially bad.

Owned Odysseys for 15 years and now Montis (built in 2016), only problem was woofer in the Odysseys that last only a week when I bought them, replaced under warranty.

I think hot humid air is going to do more damage because hot air holds a lot more water. Your conditions certainly aren't ideal. Do you run a central air conditioning system when it's warm, like we do in the US? Those that don't run AC a lot can run a dehumidifier if they need to. Growing up, we ran one in the basement.

It's promising to know you get a good lifespan out of your panels.

 

[Nuri58]

Is more likely the air polution so I'd start there - which means you IMO can't do much other than frequent washing until you change ro conventional speakers. Manila is more like a all year round smog and no mater what you do it's getting in. It can be reduced if you get a real air conditioner system actually cleaning the blown-in air (and keeping a little higher air preasure lnside than outsise) but that's more costly than the change of panels. Move to the country side is maybe another option but then you have the transport time and cost instead...

 

[roni44]

I live in Taiwan (tropical island), humidity especially during summer has not been problem for my EM ESL and previous Clarity. Does anyone smoke in the room? how about cooking fume? How about get an air purifier and dehumidifier? Vacuum every 2 month, and cover the panel when not in use ( I don't cover anymore). I rescued EM ESL (both panel had barely any audio output) from a heavy smoker, when I took it over, the panel was covered smoke gunk, dust and etc. I washed the panel best way I can then use dyson air drying no heat setting, entire process takes me little over 3 hours and brought back to life. I really don't think the humidity is the culprit, more or less has to do with air pollution.

 

[Robert D]

I live in Taiwan (tropical island), humidity especially during summer has not been problem for my EM ESL and previous Clarity. Does anyone smoke in the room? how about cooking fume? How about get an air purifier and dehumidifier? Vacuum every 2 month, and cover the panel when not in use ( I don't cover anymore). I rescued EM ESL (both panel had barely any audio output) from a heavy smoker, when I took it over, the panel was covered smoke gunk, dust and etc. I washed the panel best way I can then use dyson air drying no heat setting, entire process takes me little over 3 hours and brought back to life. I really don't think the humidity is the culprit, more or less has to do with air pollution.

You don't run a central air conditioner in your home during the summer?