Trying to resucitate Prodigys

[rhaudio]

Dear members,
I am new to the forum and to Martin Logan, although not to dipole speakers, which are my preferred ones.
Recently have purchased a pair of used Prodigys and a Logus center channel from a friend who is moving abroad.
The logus panel is dead, the Prodigy panel sounds well but very very low, the resulting sound is absolutely our of balance since the woofers seem to work properly. Need all kind of advices to put the Prodigys at their best and enjoy them. Many thanks in advance for your kind attention, best regards from Uruguay in the South America, rhaudio.

 

[Kenscollick]

I hope you got a good deal on them, Low output could be caused by the panels being dirty. Was the previous owner a smoker? hopefully not.

You can start by vacuuming the panels, this is done after they have been unplugged for at least a day. High powered vacuums are better. If that shows some improvement but not enough you are on the right track. you may have to remove the panels from the woofers and scrub them with soap and water lots of rinse.

Good luck they are a great speaker

 

[rhaudio]

Many thanks Ken for your reply.
Regretably the previous owner was (and still is) a heavy smoker.
Will insist with vaccuming the panels to determine wether if there is any improvement and surely will comment to you and ask again for your advice.
These Prodigys are my first pair of ML, but since the time i heard the SL3s a few years ago i immediately knew that i need dipoles.

Best regards from the warm and sunny Uruguayan coast.

 

[Rich]

Regretably the previous owner was (and still is) a heavy smoker.

In that case, vacuuming alone will probably not work. You are going to have to do something more extreme. There are two options that I am aware of. One is the "Shower Tweak" where you actually remove the panels and clean them in the shower. Check out this thread to learn more about it:

http://www.martinloganowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=604

Also, check this thread for some other ideas to fix a weak-sounding panel:

http://www.martinloganowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2576

If this is all too much for you, or if none of it works, the final option is to purchase new panels from Martin Logan. They are fairly reasonably priced, as I understand it. Good luck with it. The Prodigy is an awesome speaker when it is performing properly.

 

[daniel]

I don't know if it's advisable to use this on Martin Logan panel, ( use at your own risk), but I know that carpet cleaner ( spray can) are magical to remove tar, and other residue from smokers in side cars. You spray the carpet cleaner, wait 3-4 minutes, then wash with clean water.

Maybe other have tried it on Martin Logan and can give you advice base on their experience.

 

[amey01]

Regretably the previous owner was (and still is) a heavy smoker.

In that case, I'd try anything. How old are these speakers - 6-8 years or so? After that long with a heavy smoker I'd say they're pretty much wrecked.

It's probably easier to just get the new panels. Tar is sticky and gooey and won't come off with vacuuming or rinsing alone. Chemicals will probably damage the panel even further. The Prodigy is a fantastic speaker so getting halfway there is a bit pointless. You may as well just do the job properly and start enjoying!

 

[mraudio]

Since you are new to "Electrostatic" speakers, you do have them plugged in right? Also, are the jumpers in place if you're not bi-wiring them? Sorry this may sound stupid, but it could very well be the problem. Welcome to the Club!!!

 

[rhaudio]

Many thanks to all for your interest and advice.
I´m just back from a short holidays, that´s why i have not replied before.
I agree that after all that years with smoke, vaccuming will not be enough as tar is very very sticky, so i think that i should give the shower a try, but don´t know how to disasseble the panel from the woofer.
Could anybody of you assist me with information / procedure description /pics ?
Many thanks again for all your support.
At your disposal from the warm and sunny Uruguayan coast at South America.
r.h.

 

[Kenscollick]

Remove the front woofer grille, on the right side you will see the plug connection. Pull the plug. There are 4 screws holsing the ES panel to the base you will see the bottom 2 are slotted, completely remove the 2 top bolts the loosen the bottom 2 you can remove the panel. good luck.

 

[rhaudio]

Ken,
Many thanks again for your information.

I have been told by a fellow audiophile that the fact that MLs loose volume or spl is that the conductive substance vapor applied on the mylar membrane gets lost, but the membranes can be re-coated again.
Has anybody heard about this ?
Brgds, r.h.

 

[Dreamer]

Never heard that one...

I have a pair of ML Sequels that were made in 1989 (I think), and they have never been in a smoking household and they still sound great! I am the second owner, and have taken meticulous care of them--vacuuming them once a month, and keeping them clean inside and out. I'm sure that new panels would probably improve their sound, if for no other reason than the newer panels are WAY better sounding on their own, but since mine still work well and sound nice, I'm sticking with them until they NEED replaced.

I've heard other electrostatics even older than mine (Acoustats, Quads) that still sound good too. I don't know if I buy your friend's theory. The only thing that REALLY hurts ML panels is smoke--from tobacco or woodstoves.

Let me guess, your "audiophile" friend has cone speakers, right?...

--Richard

 

[rhaudio]

Well, i´m back again after some invesgation about reburbishing panels and these are mi findings:

There is a company at Rosario (Argentina) named "Catanzaro Acoustics" (http://www.catanzaroacoustics.com.ar/) who brew their own electrostatics and other products like amplifiers.

They explained to me that the worst enemies of the electrostatics are the overmodulation and alternancies betwenn low / high temperature and hummidity. Of course dust and any sticky substance (like tar and nicotine) are very harmful to the panels.

As time goes by the conductive coating of the panel deteriorates and migrates. That´s the suposed cause that my Prodigy panels sond weak.

As they don´t have exactly the same conductive coating that ML uses their task consist of removing all the original conductive coat and apply their own one giving a warranty of 3 years.

All this seems to be reasonable to me but as i live about 500 Km from their city, and in a different country, crating + trucking + customs clearance make the costs rise close to the replacement by new and original panels, and this in addition helps to keep the value of the speaker.

Could anybody tell me where/to whom in the USA can i purchase a pair of brand new / original Prodigy pannels ?

Many thanks in advance for all your assistance.

 

[amey01]

Call Jim Power at Martin Logan - he should be able to help you - but you may have to go through the distributor in your country.

 

[Adri]

Call Jim Power at Martin Logan - he should be able to help you - but you may have to go through the distributor in your country.

If there is a distributor for Uruguay, then Jim will direct him to the distributor.
ML only does direct sales in the US and countries without a distributor/importer.

Adri.

 

[Craig]

One possibility is the circuitry in your speakers may not be setup for electricity supplied in your country.

What are the standards/specs for the power supply system in Uraguay? Is it 110/120 volts at 60Hz, 110 at 50Hz, 220 volts at 50Hz, 100 volts at 50Hz or something else?

A mismatch like that could cause the weak sound from the panels while still having normal sound from the woofers.

This would be a topic to discuss with Jim Powers.

 

[rhaudio]

Many thanks for your comments.
Voltage/freq. are ok, my Prodigys born 220V / 50Hz and i´ve listened them when they were just unpacked at our local ML dealer, which no longer imports ML but continues to give all the support to the brand, regretably at a very high cost. Also could be that ML directs me to the neighbour country dealer which is in full activity, but this means paying about US$ 2.200 for the whole task which is quite a lot of money.
Does anybody know the price for replacemnt panels in the USA ?
I guess i should try buying directly in the USA, import the panels myself and pay for the handwork only, expecting to significantly reduce my costs.
Any better idea ?
Regards from Uruguay, r.h.

 

[Adri]

Many thanks for your comments.
Voltage/freq. are ok, my Prodigys born 220V / 50Hz and i´ve listened them when they were just unpacked at our local ML dealer, which no longer imports ML but continues to give all the support to the brand, regretably at a very high cost. Also could be that ML directs me to the neighbour country dealer which is in full activity, but this means paying about US$ 2.200 for the whole task which is quite a lot of money.
Does anybody know the price for replacemnt panels in the USA ?
I guess i should try buying directly in the USA, import the panels myself and pay for the handwork only, expecting to significantly reduce my costs.
Any better idea ?
Regards from Uruguay, r.h.

If you have a friend in the US, he could order the panels for you and ship them to Uruquay for you. I don't think ML will ship directly from the US to Uruquay.
Installing the new panels is easy, instructions are included, so you could do that yourself.
New panels would be in the $600-900 range when ordered in the US.

Adri.

 

[rhaudio]

Adri,
I agree with you, i will ask somebody in the USA to purchase and send to me.
Now the panels will have to wait some months as retiping my Koetsu cartridge has became now the first priority, afterwards the Prodigys.
If everything goes as i like then i will end this year listening my retiped Koetsu trhough the resucited Prodigys.
Regards from Uruguay, r.h.