Ethos vs Vista, Active Bass vs Passive Bass

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Joined
Aug 20, 2023
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Location
Cologne, Germany
Hello from Cologne dear MLO-Forum,

this is my first post - I will do a proper introduction later! Promise!! But I'm right in the middle of making a decision which ML to buy and I could use some knowledge and proper advice and I could use it fast (purchase planned for this week). After an ugly divorce from my horn speakers I thought that now or never is the time to get a type of speaker that I have never heard until now - a panel! I did audition a Magnepan 1.7 with 25k of McIntosh muscle - that was "not so great". So I heard a Visa at a private home and an Ethos today at a dealer. Both speakers did surprise me pleasantly which is good news and I'm sure that I can live with both with regards to general sound signature. There is a couple of things that are of course different but here and now I would like to direct your attention to the subject of BASS.
My room is small, too small (162sq ft) but I simulated the distance I can achieve sitting away from the speakers in both cases and I think it more or less works/is okay for both speakers. The question is - which bass can I better control in my room. The active or the passive version? The Vista was driven by a Pentagon A100 amp which is known to make Infinity Kappa 9s throw in the towel and the Ethos driven by something fancy new from Lyngdorf (in direct mode so no dsp or Dirac on). I had to turn the bass of the Ethos down to -4 -6 to be happy with most stuff playing, and the bass of the Vista was just very surprising in its heft and quantity. So can I get my amps (2 class a mono blocks/50 Watt class a Krell clones) to control the Vistas or what power-amp/integrated amp will work. With the Ethos I hope I do not have to turn the bass down all the way all the time. I'm happy for any idea, advice and please shoot away which Speaker u would get regardless of anything said before. The Vista comes with sexy cables (power and speaker) is much older but almost "not used" - it at least looks that way. It also has two black aftermarket boxes connected to the bass terminals. I have sent picture of the black-boxes to ML to figure out what those boxes are/do! The Ethos is only 5 years old, also looks and feels new and is roughly 1k more expensive. I understand that the Ethos is the much more expensive speaker but as a panel virgin both Martin Logans did offer me enough to make me very itchy to pull the trigger.
That's it for now. Thank you in advance for all you input and guidance. Greatly appreciated!! Cheers Uli
 

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If it was my money I'd likely go with the Ethos

- active bass out of the box
- DSP capabilities
- newer panels

I have no idea what that little black box leading to nowhere is hooked up to the Vista. Without incoming and outgoing connections I can't imagine it's actually doing anything.
 
Thank you Brandon,

Martin Logan thinks these boxes do and I quote "My best guess is something that alters the impedance that the connected amplifier sees, allegedly making them easier to drive ..." the company does still exist so I have written an email.

Your other points sure do make sense.
Cheers
 
Age is an important factor with panels, appearance of light use on an older speaker could be deceiving, I’d go with the new panels. Another unrelated comment, I too have a small room using classic 9’s, the use of proper acoustic panels in the room (behind the panels and at first reflection points), made a huge difference so regardless of which speaker you get, make sure to treat the room, dipole speakers don’t play nice in small rooms without treatment!
 
Well, I did a thing today! In the end - the age-thing got to me. So after driving like 1500km the last days I have picked up my Ethos today. It was really really hot today here in Germany so it was tough to do all the carrying and unpacking but I must say ML sure does spend one or two thoughts about how to package a product. And what do I think? Well, sure it it is way to early to make any valid statement - but let me quote "sprockets" here: "I'm as happy as a little girl. My initial "haven't got a clue" placement right out of the box is already suggesting that this is going to be pretty amazing.
So thanx for all the smart advice and yes the room needs work!
Before I forget - one thing I did is tilt the Ethos into an almost upright/straight position - does indeed improve things for me. And I put my brave-pants on and bass ist set to -4.
Cheers Uli
 

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If it was my money I'd likely go with the Ethos

- active bass out of the box
- DSP capabilities
- newer panels

I have no idea what that little black box leading to nowhere is hooked up to the Vista. Without incoming and outgoing connections I can't imagine it's actually doing anything.
I think it is a sort of a filter that i cannot remember the name off, but shold have some sonic effect making the panels even better. When i recall I'll link to a video explainig this.
 
I think it is a sort of a filter that i cannot remember the name off, but shold have some sonic effect making the panels even better. When i recall I'll link to a video explainig this.
I'm very skeptical that sticking a fancy box in between your speaker terminals makes any difference. Unless they're bypassing the internal crossover and adding an external one basically in the middle of the binding post jumpers. Strange either way
 
Yah, i still can't remember the name but saw a diy youtube on it. Didn't get neither how it worked nor why any manufacturer would not build it in if it made the aclaimed improvements.
 
Well, if you look at let's say cars - what would all the tuners and modders do?
Well, I cannot comment on the Vista and Vista bass-performance with that box anymore - but with regards to the Ethos and it is very early days in case of setup and adjusting indeed my very initial reaction to the bass in my setup and my room would be "a little less and a little different would be a little better". So I at least can see why somebody would try to do something like that. Again from what I heard from the Vista with the box in action I can not judge if it does work as intend or even does make things worse. But without listening to that Vista in that cellar I would not be owning a Martin Logan speaker right now.
But nethertheless the Ethos is behaving very politely in my room and I could hardly be any happier ...
 
I'm very skeptical that sticking a fancy box in between your speaker terminals makes any difference. Unless they're bypassing the internal crossover and adding an external one basically in the middle of the binding post jumpers. Strange either way
You didn't by coincidence try to remove the box when listening to the Vistas? But I thing you made the right choice in getting the Ethos - Some years back these were the ones I were dreaming to get, but that shouldn't be.
 
Yah, i still can't remember the name but saw a diy youtube on it. Didn't get neither how it worked nor why any manufacturer would not build it in if it made the aclaimed improvements.
Only benefit of having it outside the cabinet I can think of is if it breaks down, anyone can easily replace it. I guess another would be if it produced a lot of heat.
 
You didn't by coincidence try to remove the box when listening to the Vistas? But I thing you made the right choice in getting the Ethos - Some years back these were the ones I were dreaming to get, but that shouldn't be.
Nope, did not. First I did not notice them plus this being my first ML-experience ever I tried to focus and make sense of what I was hearing ...
I had a long long listening session today with the Ethos - and I'm beginning to wonder "what have I been doing all these years". This is getting better and better ...
 
I'm not familiar with either model but based on the information you gave it sounds like you made the right call.
I hope but I do not know. I have briefly heard 2 other models. A new ElectroMotion ESL X at the place where I had the Magnepan 1.7 debacle and then the 2006 Vista from private owner. It is almost impossible these days to listen to Magnepans at dealers and at least very very hard to find a dealer where one can audition a Martin Logan. So my experience with any panel-speakers is minimal to non-existing - stuff like Apogee or Eurostatic or Diptyque or whatever is just extremely rare around here. Yes, there are some Quads but ...
Just based on what I'm hearing in my room now vs what was in my system before - I'm pretty excited. But I do not know what other current MLs sound like at a similar amount for a used variant.
 
I think you'll be happy with the decision you made, you'll enjoy those and they should last a very long time. With the price of replacement panels it's almost more worthwhile to just buy another used pair of Martin Logan's everytime panels need replacing.
 
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