Super Summits

[DrJRapp]

I'm a self admitted classical music fan, a huge classical music fan. I used to have a season subscription to the late great Florida Philharmonic/Pops orchestra directed by Peter Nero. I had 12th row center seats in Kravits Center, the magnificent concert edifice that was constructed 15 years ago with both aural excellence and architectural magnificence in mind. Every concert was a true experience, some being beyond exceptional, all definitly memorable.

I was able to have one of those memorable experiences tonight. I am home alone while everyone else is out shopping for the holidays. BMG music had delivered a unrequested disc that seemed intreging. Vivaldi by the Venice Baroque Orchestra with Giuliano Carmignola (a prince of baroque violin). I cranked up the volume and was awestruct with what emerged from The Summits. The sweetness of the violin, the timbre of the clavicord the thunder of the tympanys were soooo lifelike. The music filled my 7000 cu ft family room/kitchen with power and majesty only rivaled by the real thing at Kravits Center, the soft delicate passages setting my spine to tingling.

My thoughts drifted to talk here of the possibility of a larger, more costly version of The Summit and I asked myself.......why?

 

[JonFo]

...
My thoughts drifted to talk here of the possibility of a larger, more costly version of The Summit and I asked myself.......why?

Well, ever heard a Statement e2 well set up?

With a line array of Mid-bass to supplement that stunning ESL sound, you will find that the 'effortless' aspects of an ML are magnified.
Also, clean ultra-low frequencies recreated by a well-integrated, big, clean sub are a must.

Even classical requires good reproduction of mid-bass and low frequencies.

But agreed, a Summit is an awesome speaker, and its ability to do most things very, very well is a testament to its great design.

 

[Joey_V]

My thoughts drifted to talk here of the possibility of a larger, more costly version of The Summit and I asked myself.......why?

Why not?

I, for one, am looking forward to the Super Summit... and I'm going to divert whatever income I have during residency to acquiring one, no matter what.

Joey

 

[Reverb2009]

no matter what.

Bring on the Top Raman.

 

[aliveatfive]

Jerry -

I agree with you wholeheartedly. I had much the same experience as you yesterday listening to Brahms and Rachmaninov. Summits plus high quality amplification and quality source material are musical nirvana.

 

[DrJRapp]

Well, ever heard a Statement e2 well set up?

Perhaps you really need to listen to Summits well set up. That's far easier to do than finding a pair of e2s around. Nothing is lacking in mid or lower bass. For music I prefer multiple quicker, more defined and musical subs to a large slow one no matter how well integrated. I'll leave the large one for LFE on HT where there actually is some ultra low freq. information. Most music doesn't dig as deep as the Summit's 25 hz already does.

 

[Joey_V]

Perhaps you really need to listen to Summits well set up. That's far easier to do than finding a pair of e2s around. Nothing is lacking in mid or lower bass. For music I prefer multiple quicker, more defined and musical subs to a large slow one no matter how well integrated. I'll leave the large one for LFE on HT where there actually is some ultra low freq. information. Most music doesn't dig as deep as the Summit's 25 hz already does.

I think JonFo was merely "joking" with his first comment. Your question was why would there be the need to "upgrade" when the Summits are already so good...?

So the natural answer is because there is better. Regardless of how good the Summit, is, I can pretty much guarantee that no one on this board would disagree that the Statements are indeed better.

So, why would one need to have a desire to upgrade?

The answer is simple: Because the Super Summit will be better, or atleast the Super Summit will be designed with the objective goal of building a technically "better" speaker than the Summit, per ML.

 

[aliveatfive]

I think JonFo was merely "joking" with his first comment. Your question was why would there be the need to "upgrade" when the Summits are already so good...?

So the natural answer is because there is better. Regardless of how good the Summit, is, I can pretty much guarantee that no one on this board would disagree that the Statements are indeed better.

So, why would one need to have a desire to upgrade?

The answer is simple: Because the Super Summit will be better, or atleast the Super Summit will be designed with the objective goal of building a technically "better" speaker than the Summit, per ML.

Joey -

Until I hear it from ML, I just don't believe it will happen. I'm sure the "bean counters" over there are very careful about how they allocate resources. How may 20-30k loudspeakers do you think are sold, world-wide?

 

[Joey_V]

Joey -

Until I hear it from ML, I just don't believe it will happen. I'm sure the "bean counters" over there are very careful about how they allocate resources. How may 20-30k loudspeakers do you think are sold, world-wide?

True true... it's all up in the air, but my local audiophile friend Steve (stesom on the board) talked to ML corporate themselves in person and was told of this $17K speaker that they are developing, hence the name "Super Summit".

Wishful thinking? Maybe... but it's nice to dream once in a while, no?

Joey

 

[DrJRapp]

How many pair of Statements were ever made/sold?

Perhaps ML should just raise the price of The Summits to $15k (where it probably belongs anyway) then the public's ( well at least Joey V & JonFo's) perception of them would be better.

I think ML is about to do that (at least partially) soon.

 

[Charliemike]

How many pair of Statements were ever made/sold?

Perhaps ML should just raise the price of The Summits to $15k (where it probably belongs anyway) then the public's ( well at least Joey V & JonFo's) perception of them would be better.

I think ML is about to do that (at least partially) soon.

No! Don't raise them! Then the Vantages and Vistas go up and I'll never own them! :banghead:

 

[Joey_V]

Perhaps ML should just raise the price of The Summits to $15k (where it probably belongs anyway) then the public's ( well at least Joey V & JonFo's) perception of them would be better.

That's not what I'm saying, Jerry. Price does not necessarily mean better, but I brought up the price bit earlier to illustrate that ML is indeed thinking of making a more "technically" superior ESL. Whether this is true, is up in the air, BUT if it is, there is a good chance that this should be "subjectively better" than the Summit especially if it was made by ML to be technically superior from their standpoint.

Price does not necessarily equate to a better speaker, but technical improvements made by the same company to a speaker does correlate to a better speaker.

However, we are all speculating on something that may not even need to be speculated upon, so in that sense... all this rambling is sort of pointless.

Joey

 

[DrJRapp]

That's not what I'm saying, Jerry. Price does not necessarily mean better, but I brought up the price bit earlier to illustrate that ML is indeed thinking of making a more "technically" superior ESL. Whether this is true, is up in the air, BUT if it is, there is a good chance that this should be "subjectively better" than the Summit especially if it was made by ML to be technically superior from their standpoint.

Price does not necessarily equate to a better speaker, but technical improvements made by the same company to a speaker does correlate to a better speaker.

However, we are all speculating on something that may not even need to be speculated upon, so in that sense... all this rambling is sort of pointless.

Joey

Joey,

The technical improvements in the Summit/Vantage/Vista were many years in the making, and came mostly from improved manufacturing techniques. There was a significant capital investment made to bring them to the market. I doubt we'll see improvements in the elemental design for a long while. What we may see is the current ESL technology applied to a "full range" type speaker. I'm not sure that would improve upon the Summit.

 

[Reverb2009]

Joey,

The technical improvements in the Summit/Vantage/Vista were many years in the making, and came mostly from improved manufacturing techniques. There was a significant capital investment made to bring them to the market. I doubt we'll see improvements in the elemental design for a long while. What we may see is the current ESL technology applied to a "full range" type speaker. I'm not sure that would improve upon the Summit.

Yes there is a new “full range” speaker coming called the CLX the replacement for the CLSIIz, price is estimated at around $7000 US.

 

[Robin]

Two Pair of CLX's...

Yes there is a new “full range” speaker coming called the CLX the replacement for the CLSIIz, price is estimated at around $7000 US.

Joe,

You know I was thinking, if the new CLX's are only going to cost $7K for a matched pair, I might just purchase two pair and bridge with four monoblocks amplifiers in stereo... I'm not quite sure how to bridge four class "A" monoblocks to a preamp for stereo (plus subwoofer) music listening? Do you know how to wire this kinda configuration??

 

[risabet]

Joey,

The technical improvements in the Summit/Vantage/Vista were many years in the making, and came mostly from improved manufacturing techniques. There was a significant capital investment made to bring them to the market. I doubt we'll see improvements in the elemental design for a long while. What we may see is the current ESL technology applied to a "full range" type speaker. I'm not sure that would improve upon the Summit.

I am pretty confident that the CLX would best the Summit in areas of coherence and speed from top to bottom. All things being equal the Summit should play louder, deeper, and with more slam. Take your pick as to which is better.

 

[Reverb2009]

I am pretty confident that the CLX would best the Summit in areas of coherence and speed from top to bottom. All things being equal the Summit should play louder, deeper, and with more slam. Take your pick as to which is better.

Since we have seen photos of the Descent i and know it has a crossover position named “CLX” the real test would be CLX paired with the Descent i vs. Summit.

 

[Reverb2009]

Joe,

You know I was thinking, if the new CLX's are only going to cost $7K for a matched pair, I might just purchase two pair and bridge with four monoblocks amplifiers in stereo... I'm not quite sure how to bridge four class "A" monoblocks to a preamp for stereo (plus subwoofer) music listening? Do you know how to wire this kinda configuration??

Four CLX’s! That would be an interesting setup.


You could either get a “Y” connector to split the R & L channels from the pre-amp to the mono amps or Audioquest has an interconnect option called “pig tailed”, it’s a single ended interconnect at the pre-amp and at the amp end is a 2nd run of cable coming out of the connecter for the 2nd amp, No “Y” connector needed.

 

[Peter Hogan]

Perhaps ML should just raise the price of The Summits to $15k (where it probably belongs anyway) .

The Summits were just raised to 12K at the local Tweeter near me...not too far from the 15K you mention...

Peter

 

[Joey_V]

The Summits were just raised to 12K at the local Tweeter near me...not too far from the 15K you mention...

Peter

Holy mother..... .

Glad I bought mine early this year...