Another Newbie

[redbullet]

Hey to All !

I just moved to a pair of Ascent's from a pair of Maggie MGIII's ,
1st impressions is they do not have the top end the maggies have and bass is little muddy. the latter does not bother me as much as the lack of top end.
I am also having a tougher time get them in the right spot.
Any suggestions of thoughts would be appreciated .

 

[Rich]

Any suggestions of thoughts would be appreciated .

We can't help you much without more information. What size room are these in? How do you have them placed? What components are you using with them (source, amp, preamp, cables)?

If set up properly, the Ascents should have good, tight bass that is more pronounced than your maggies. If it is muddy, you may have a component mismatch or have them set up poorly. The Ascent also has a pretty impressive top end, so again I wonder if you have are using components that aren't capable of driving them properly. Give us more information about your setup and we can perhaps give you some suggestions.

 

[TrumpetDoug]

They Don't have the top end?? The bass is muddy?? Sorry this does not add up. Gotta agree with Rich here, we need more info on your associated equipment and the room and the placement. However, you should be able to stand these puppies on their head in your bathroom with the shower running and not really have the sound qualities you are describing.

Doug - out

 

[redbullet]

We can't help you much without more information. What size room are these in? How do you have them placed? What components are you using with them (source, amp, preamp, cables)?

My room is 14 x 25 x 9 high. They are placed along the 14' side with carpet on the left and right walls to kill some of the refections. Hard wood floor with a 9 x 10 rug down on it. At the moment I am using a Emotiva RSP-1 Preamp and a XP-5 power amp Bi-Amping using 4 out of the 5 channels, which can do 375 watts @ 4 ohms.
Here's a link

http://www.emotiva.com/xpa5.html
I was using the same for the maggies , I will be moving to use some Quicksilver mono's for the top end .

 

[Rich]

That is a good size room. How far are the speaker's panels from the front and side walls? How much are they toed in? Placement has a huge effect on the sound of these speakers. Do you have the floor spikes installed on them or are you using the feet?

Have you tried removing the carpet from the side walls and listening to the sound? Carpet is not an ideal absorber. It absorbs the high end but not the mid and lower frequencies, so you get rolled off highs and you still get mid-bass reflections that can muddy the soundstage and imaging.

As for your amp, it appears to be more of a home theater type amp than a serious two-channel amp. It may not produce the current necessary to properly drive an electrostat. I notice that it does not double down its output wattage with a halving of impedance. This means it is not as stable in its output into low impedances. Your Ascents dip down to less than 2 ohms at the higher frequencies. If your amp can not handle this sort of impedance variation without strain, it will affect your high frequency response. This could be part of the problem you are experiencing.

Are you using the RSP-1's integrated bass management features? Have you played with the bass level control on the rear of the Ascents? Either of these could have an effect on your bass.

You don't mention the source or speaker cables and interconnects you are using. These can have an effect on the sound as well.

Ultimately, you will find that the Ascents are very revealing of the quality of the upstream components. They will reveal any weaknesses, but will reward you with incredible sound if you feed them right. Just as a comparison: the Ascents were $4,000 brand new and the amp and preamp you are running them with costs about $1,400 brand new. This is a pretty good indicator of the difference in quality between these components. If you skimp on the amp and preamp with these speakers, you are not likely to get them to perform at their best ability.

 

[redbullet]

Well gonna play around some more today, I really need the carpet because the room is very live. I am really a Tube guy so your right the Ht amp might be whats annoying the crap out of me.

 

[redbullet]

Well after playing around this weekend, They ended up about 2.5 ft from the back wall and 3 ft each from the side with 1/3 rd toe in and it all came together, even bass, great highs and of coarse image. This is where in my mind would never of thought, but guess whatever works !

 

[sleepysurf]

Nice to hear it's coming together now. I presume you bought these used. If you haven't already done so, unplug them overnight, and thoroughly vacuum the panels, front and back. Lots of dust/dirt will dampen their performance, especially the high end.

 

[Adamo]

Those Ascents were mine and they were regularly vaccumed (twice per month) so they never had dust build up. however they were bagged and packed up for some time so like I said, you should vaccume them before you power them up. But trust me, once you get your placement correct, you will love them. The Ascents are a fantastic speaker, and can produce better low end and upper extension than those Maggies. Your current placement is a good starting point. 3ft from the rears and 2ft from the sides is right on. From there you want to move them in small increments of just a few inches toward the wall then listen...then a few inches closer to the back wall and listen. Too far in any direction and you will know it. Be patient with the placement and you'll be rewarded. Also use the flash light method for your toe-in. Take a flash light from your seating position and shine it at each panel. you will notice a bar of light that travels the length of the panel. you want that to be about 1/3 the panel width from the inside edge of the panel. once you have dialed that in, you'll immediately notice an improvement. I know you are actively bi-amping these, and they won't use the same first order xovers as your maggies did. I would PM JonFo and get his insight on where to set the xovers. He'll be a great help here. Also, try using the stock internal xovers in the logans and give it a listen. you may be happy with just passive bi-amping these.
Of course you can call me anytime and I'd be happy to help. I loved those Ascents and I know you will too once you get them dialed in.
Cheers,
Adam

 

[redbullet]

Those Ascents were mine and they were regularly vaccumed (twice per month) so they never had dust build up. however they were bagged and packed up for some time so like I said, you should vaccume them before you power them up. But trust me, once you get your placement correct, you will love them.

I am just using the passive bi-amp. Now by moving them around a bit they have become a whole another animal. I just received a pair of Quicksilver monos that are going to drive the panels with and use the SS for the lows. I think a lot had to do with being so use to Tube amps. I really never cared for SS running the upper end of any speaker. I did talk to Emotiva and they said the amp and it's power supply would have no problem drive these. The journey to perfection will continue :music:

Dave

 

[Adamo]

Hey Dave,
I think you're on the right track. It's seriously ALL about the placement when it comes to these speakers. Literally if one speaker is 2 inches in front of the other it will impact the imaging. They are notoriously difficult to set up, but the end result is soooooooo worth it. The only bad sounding Ascent is one that is poorly set up (or if upstream isn't matched well). You'll be impressed with it once you get them firing on all cylinders. Please let me know if I can help at all with getting them to your liking.
Cheers,
Adam