How much power is enough power?

I believe that clean power can really extend life of any vacuum cleaner on this planet, therefore it's best to have an amplifier that can be used for this purpose in its spare time, sure will increase the WAF of the big box

To be a bit redundant, it is not the quantity of the watts but the quality. This is something that many people seem to ignore. Get the "best" amp that you can afford. If need be, get a less powerful amp as long as it sounds better to you. Keep in mind that one that truly doubles its power as the impedance halves is important AND depending upon the ML speaker, the amp should be truly functional at the 1 ohm mark.

Usually this means spending large amounts of money. See audiogon and get an excellent quality older amp that meets the specs mentioned above. Those behometh amplifiers are big and heavy for a reason.

Disclaimer: I know very little about D-class amps.

Dominick22 said:

I agree and would love to see this as well. A McIntosh needle video would be awesome and it would be cool to even watch the needle as the volume was increased!

A big 2nd motion from me!
Someone please do this for us!

Dominick

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I've been here a couple years and have yet to figure out how to post a picture let alone a movie!

What I can say is depending on the music and the quality of the recording, my needles on both the pre and amps are accurate. Very compressed music and the needles look like they are stuck at wherever I place them. Well recorded and uncompressed and the needles look like they are ready to jump out of the pieces.

Gordon

DrJRapp said:

Audio power is like money...you can live on a little, but you can never have too much!

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Damn that's true! I love it.

robertawillisjr said:

Keep in mind that one that truly doubles its power as the impedance halves is important

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This is true for some designs but not others... Atma- sphere is an OTL design and does not buy into the load sensitivity stuff. Here's an amplifier "myth busting" paper from their web site:

http://atma-sphere.com/papers/myth.html

Subjectively, it's the best amp I have heard on the Logans with a powered woofer. I do prefer more powerful amps driving the Soundlabs, however.

There is another theory...

Some folks with highly sensitive speakers believe that once you have enough power and the amplifier design is the same, the extra circuits and wiring to deliver more power take away from the sound quality. Personally, I have not experienced that, but I'm an "electrostat only" fan.

JMAUSGP said:

I think the only universal truth is buy as much as you can afford and then just a touch more, because you can always buy more than you can afford. And that is the truth.

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Let me guess: you went shopping for a Porsche but came home with a Ferrari.

David Matz said:

This is true for some designs but not others... Atma- sphere is an OTL design and does not buy into the load sensitivity stuff. Here's an amplifier "myth busting" paper from their web site:

http://atma-sphere.com/papers/myth.html

Subjectively, it's the best amp I have heard on the Logans with a powered woofer. I do prefer more powerful amps driving the Soundlabs, however.

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Well the paper doesn't disprove what I wrote. I think we need to take advertisement with a grain of salt. I was somewhat misleading in that good tube amp designs generally handle impedance differently as (I have read do the class D designs)

Since I haven't been involved in amp design for 20 years or so, I hesitate to go beyond the statements that I made in my earlier post. I do note that the design used by Atma-Sphere was (is?) noted for its reliability and ability to match a wide range of impedance. Which is my point. Any speaker driving an ML speaker (particularly legacy models) needs to be capable of handling the impedance differences required throughout the frequency spectrum.

Bernard said:

Let me guess: you went shopping for a Porsche but came home with a Ferrari.

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Not originally, I actually went shopping for a pair of Bose 901s and ended up with a 4 Martin Logan Stylos and a Logos. True story, that was more than I had intended to spend and also at the time more than I could afford.

But when I heard THAT sound, well I just couldn't help myself, well I could, but I didn't really want too and so I told my wife and anyone that would listen that I was helpless, I could no longer control myself.

Even now that sounds worse than what I mean't. Assuming I mean't what I said.

I bought an Aragon 8008 today... we'll give that one a try and see how it sounds.

Gordon Gray said:

Oh yes Justin, I also liked your post. Sometimes I actually understand your humor.

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Humourous maybe, but in this case with a startling amount of truth behind it too, I like to think.

Hello,
Hocky, you chose an excellent Amplifier. Is your 8008 an BB or ST? Regardless, truly an fantastic choice for driving Martin Logans.

The 8008 Series use huge Toroidal Transformers and offer large amounts of Capacitance. I have used an 8008bb for years and absolutely love it.

I will point out that the 8008's have a fairly low Input Impedance of 22 kOhms
which can be an issue when using an AVR as your Preamp. The issue being getting the maximum available power due to some AVR's not having a great preamp section where it has issues driving the Aragon's Inputs.

Here is a Review which discusses this: http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_6_2/aragon8008x3.html
Cheers,
JJ

Hocky said:

I bought an Aragon 8008 today... we'll give that one a try and see how it sounds.

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And exactly which Aragon 8008 did you buy, there are several with those pesky letters and numbers after them?

Hello,
Be it an ST, BB, X3, or X5, all of them will do an excellent job of driving Martin Logans. The BB is especially sweet in that it uses dual 1.2 kVA Toroidal Transformers and twice the Capacitance of the ST. And the BB offers XLR Connectors.

Mondial's goal with the Aragon line was the ability to drive any Speaker out there. Coupled with being made in America with excellent Build Quality and they truly are a great value. They have great resale value as well and sell quickly on Audiogon.
Cheers,
JJ

1.21 Gigawatts?

Nah... not enough

JMAUSGP said:

And exactly which Aragon 8008 did you buy, there are several with those pesky letters and numbers after them?

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I actually got an X3 since I've really been lookin for a 3 channel, anyway. I really want to drive my center channel the same as the L&R. I am excited to give it a shot! If I like it, I'll probably pick up another for the rear 3 channels for... you know... when I upgrade to esl all around. haha

User211 said:

Humourous maybe, but in this case with a startling amount of truth behind it too, I like to think.

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Agreed my friend.

Hello,
The link I posted is for your particular Model. It is from Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity. I really think that you will enjoy it.
Cheers,
JJ

Jungle Jack said:

Hello,
The link I posted is for your particular Model. It is from Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity. I really think that you will enjoy it.
Cheers,
JJ

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Reading it now, thanks!

Congrats Hocky,

Seems like the thread may come to a happy conclusion. Amazing amount of knowledge on this site. Although sometimes, I think folks can be a bit too passive.

Now, I want to tell you about these dot things you can stick on your windows.

Gordon