Law of Diminishing Returns?

[mosttoysrk]

I started to get the upgrade itch today to add a 2nd MC275 for my CLSI system (1 mc275, c2200 preamp, Descent) then after visiting the McIntosh forum at Audiokarma I noticed a post where someone had just done "an upgrade to 2 MC501 monoblocks from a MC275.... Hmmmmm pretty much same price as 2 MC275's and I don't have to worry about tube life... and supposedly sounds as good if not better???? and much later if I purchase CLX's I'm set.... Then reason set in and wondered how big a difference I would notice/dollar spent.
Any thoughts?

 

[FOUNTAIN]

I started to get the upgrade itch today to add a 2nd MC275 for my CLSI system (1 mc275, c2200 preamp, Descent) then after visiting the McIntosh forum at Audiokarma I noticed a post where someone had just done "an upgrade to 2 MC501 monoblocks from a MC275.... Hmmmmm pretty much same price as 2 MC275's and I don't have to worry about tube life... and supposedly sounds as good if not better???? and much later if I purchase CLX's I'm set.... Then reason set in and wondered how big a difference I would notice/dollar spent.
Any thoughts?

That's a good question. I have been pondering adding a second mc275 as well, but was not sure of the sonic benefits. I'm sorry that I don't have a suggestion, but I am interested to hear what you find out.

Glen

 

[Gordon]

My Mac dealer let me bring home 2 275's and 2 501's. The 275's were a mighty fine sounding amp on the Vantage. I ended up keeping the 501's and believe they can power whatever speaker I may bring home in the future. I prefered the sound of the 501 with the tube pre (C2200). So I got a bit of tube and the carefree operation of the SS amps.

If you like to roll tubes then obviously the 275 is the ticket. I like the no maintenance aspect.

Gordon

 

[User211]

Hm fear of tubes:devil:. Nuts - one goes, plug another in. Takes 10 seconds. And they hardly ever go if you use a reliable KT88.

Anyway - good luck!

 

[Bernard]

Hm fear of tubes:devil:. Nuts - one goes, plug another in. Takes 10 seconds. And they hardly ever go if you use a reliable KT88.

Anyway - good luck!

I just had a 6550 go defective on me. Did not go quietly, but made lots of intermittent noise - scared the crap out of me. But as you said, plugged in a new one, and all is well until I get a new matched pair. A "reliable KT88"? They all go eventually. But of course, they sound SO much better than SS !

Can't replace a transistor that easily as they usually take out everything else around.

 

[User211]

Bernard, for all the sins that SS commits, and all the sins that tubes commit, I'll take the tube option.

Recently got really underwhelmed by some Krell Evos driving Wilson Sophia 2s. Then got blown away by Jadis JA200s driving the CLX. Tunes + Logans = made for each other. But that's only my judgement.

I have yet to have a 211 go on me. So far, the most relible tube I have ever met, and I have met a few. Least reliable - Golden Dragon EL84s. Bl**dy awful. As for KT88s/6550s for reliability (not sound) I rate Sovtek, JJ, and the original Tung-Sol 6550 (very good valve).

For SS driving Logans, I would go for Electrocompaniet. Years ago, they drove my Aerius really very well indeed. I was really impressed. Almost a convert, infact. Never heard another SS amp sound so good through Logans. So that is my SS recommendation.

Of the SS amps I have owned, well, they go wrong too. Start humming, switches break, no output in one channel, noisy pots. Background hum was the most common problem.

We should start a thread about practical experience and reliability. In fact, I think I will tomorrow.

 

[Waboman]

I'm in the process of replacing 2 Krell amps with Macs. Though not as fancy as the 501's, I'm thinking about getting the MC402 for my Prodigies and the MC205 for my Theater and Scripts. It's good too know so many Logan owners use Macs to power their beloved speakers.

 

[C.A.P]

As a Krell owner and a fan I will have to bite my tongue.

 

[Waboman]

Lol. I had one of the channels on my KAV-1500 go out. This is the 2nd time this has happened. Do you have any idea what it's like to rip that amp out of your system, box it up and ship it to Krell? It's not a pretty site. I'm tired of that amp, as for my FPB-300, it's served me well these many years. However, since I'm getting rid of the KAV-1500, it's time to say goodbye to the FPB.

 

[C.A.P]

As good as Krell is, Its a bear to ship and wait. Been there done that. I can say that the Macs are a damn good replacement. Someday I will demo a pair of MC 275 with my CLS to see how smooth they are.

 

[mosttoysrk]

CAP,
If I remember correctly we spoke quite awhile ago about stands for the CLS and you have a business connection here in the Northwest (Seattle), next time you come to town let me know, I'll have you over for a few drinks and dinner and you can listen to my CLSI, C2200, and single MC275... maybe 2 soon.
Thanks for all the replies, I think I am going to stick with the tubes.
I did have a Krell KSA-250 and KBL... finally got around to putting them on Craigslist about 2 weeks ago, sold them in less than 8 hours...guy paid me with a stack of 20's......hmmmm

 

[C.A.P]

CAP,
If I remember correctly we spoke quite awhile ago about stands for the CLS and you have a business connection here in the Northwest (Seattle), next time you come to town let me know, I'll have you over for a few drinks and dinner and you can listen to my CLSI, C2200, and single MC275... maybe 2 soon.
Thanks for all the replies, I think I am going to stick with the tubes.
I did have a Krell KSA-250 and KBL... finally got around to putting them on Craigslist about 2 weeks ago, sold them in less than 8 hours...guy paid me with a stack of 20's......hmmmm

I will be in town Nov. 5th through the 7th. I will be available if you are Wed after work. Maybe Thursday night but it may be tight. I can fly in Tuesday and be available Tuesday night ?????

 

[tonepub]

I'll let you know if I change my mind after the new CJ 275 watt monos get here as far as the tube thing goes.

I've never had a ton of trouble with tubes over the years, having owned a fair amount of CJ, ARC, Manley. It's just with leaving my system on for days on end, I like just having four tubes in the pre and two in the phono pre to worry about....

And I haven't heard a tube amp I like as much as my SS Premier 350. Never thought I'd hear myself say that, but I'm still looking..

Like those Clayton Audio Class A amps too, and the Luxman Class A stuff really closes the gap, getting that wonderful airiness you get with tubes, but with the grip and dynamics of SS.

But there's great stuff on both sides of the fence. Trying to get an ARC Ref 110 too, so who knows?

Manley 250's are a ton of fun too!

 

[Waboman]

As good as Krell is, Its a bear to ship and wait. Been there done that. I can say that the Macs are a damn good replacement. Someday I will demo a pair of MC 275 with my CLS to see how smooth they are.

Yeah, tearing out any piece of gear and playing the shipping/waiting game is a PITA. However, with Krells and the way they're built (like tanks) it's a much more back breaking process.

I'm still in the planning stages of getting the Macs. But I'm fairly excited nonetheless.

The KPS25sc is a serious component. Does the top turn opaque when you play a CD? Way cool.

 

[mosttoysrk]

I will be in town Nov. 5th through the 7th. I will be available if you are Wed after work. Maybe Thursday night but it may be tight. I can fly in Tuesday and be available Tuesday night ?????

CAP,
I have to go in for some minor surgery on the 4th of November and unfortunately I won't be good company for a few days after. If you come in anytime in December it is a go for sure, keep me posted. Sorry about that, and a quick note to tonepub, we tried to connect when I was in Portland on business but you were pretty busy, I will try again especially after you get the CLX's in.
rich

 

[tonepub]

Hi Rich:

Good luck on the surgery and we are just putting the new issue to bed. Please give a shout when you are in the neighborhood, we can get together then...