This is what I use. I got this with the Prodigy speakers when I bought them used. It's what the original owner used until he passed away. They sound good to me. He had some nice equipment.
Speaker Cable Questions
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andrew.hendler
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I can pull the plugs out, but they are nordost red dawn power cables which are a bit of a tight fit. So it's just a PITA to do so each time I want to swap cable. It's the most minor of problems - just wanted to understand. Thanks for the comment - what you described is what I was thinking.
andrew.hendler
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These are not cheap! Just looked up and $2,100 for 3 meters. A bit more than I want to spend, but if it ends the journey ...
simple really, good specs(resistance, capacitance), good construction and a fair price.
You had stated that some cables 'sound better' with some music over other music ?? There is simply no real logic to that from any perspective I can think of. Speaker differences with respect to room interaction, yes I can clearly vouch for that.
No that wasn't me, I've used Frank's(Signal cable) along with some balanced DH Labs (bought used) IC's for as long as I can remember.
Again, in the end it's your money but I for one follow the science not the 'flavor of the day' !
andrew.hendler
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It's an age old debate, we can agree to disagree. That said, what I was specifically referring too was some higher end cables that have a more romantic tuning. They're playing with some of the characteristics of the wire for a house sound. But if it's not flat, even if it's pleasing - I have found - it will make certain recordings sound better and certain recordings sound worse based on what the cable is doing to tonality, and how the recordings themselves are tuned.
That aside, what really surprised me was that I could hear a difference between pro wire. The Mogami 3103 and Canare 4s11 specifically. Mogami is more forward and detailed, Canare is smoother and more musical. Put another way, the Mogami is brighter and the Canare is warmer. Now, it could be that it's an interaction with the amp, an interaction with the ESLs, or something else - but it was there. I preferred the Canare. Sure it's possible that there is a cognitive bias there, but I don't know why I'd gravitate toward cheaper pro wire - the Mogami is the more expensive of the two and I already bought it. In fact, the Mogami looks nicer, has nicer connectors and is fully dressed as I had it custom made. I got the Canare 4s11 fromk B&H and it's plain jain. It's not night and day by any means, but it's enough that it changes my enjoyment significantly, and yes - I believe if I did a double blind ABX test I would be able to pick it out. I have no doubt I could pick out the higher priced audiophile cable vs the pro cable - not because it's better, but because it's different (I like the pro cable better).
What I really love about these speakers is the ability to tune them. I can adjust the rake and get more lower treble, or adjust it the other way to push it back a little. I can turn up or down the bass with a knob. What I'm finding is that since the speaker is so tunable, I want something as flat as possible - because if there are any significant peaks or troughs that a cable is causing, it makes it that much harder to tune the speakers.
I reached out to Frank at Signal Cables and I think I will give them a try. That said, I'm nearly certain that my long term cable will be the Canare 4S11. I have only been auditioning cables for a week or two - but after some extensive listening, I think that works the best for me and what I've described above.
Anhow, I very much appreciate both your help and guidance - as MLs are definitely not the simplest of speakers - and it's really helped to get me going.
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Gordon Gray
Well-known member
Hi Dave,
Hope you and family are well.
FWIW. I do not consider Shunyata Research (SR) to be "a flavor of the day" cable manufacturer but a company that is very much science oriented. Clear Image Scientific (CIS) is a medical company that has done research on eliminating the effects "noise" has on low level signal resolution and visual imaging systems.
CSI and SR were both founded Caelin Gabriel. If this interests you, check out the CIS website. It may change your mind regarding SR and the flavor of the day comment. FYI, I have the Signal Cable Silver Resolution speaker wire in my system (40 foot runs) and am very pleased with the product. And, like you, I am a big fan of Frank.
Be well.
Gordon
Hope you and family are well.
FWIW. I do not consider Shunyata Research (SR) to be "a flavor of the day" cable manufacturer but a company that is very much science oriented. Clear Image Scientific (CIS) is a medical company that has done research on eliminating the effects "noise" has on low level signal resolution and visual imaging systems.
CSI and SR were both founded Caelin Gabriel. If this interests you, check out the CIS website. It may change your mind regarding SR and the flavor of the day comment. FYI, I have the Signal Cable Silver Resolution speaker wire in my system (40 foot runs) and am very pleased with the product. And, like you, I am a big fan of Frank.
Be well.
Gordon
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They worked for me because they came with my speakers and were in a sense "free".
hey Gordon, all well on this end, hope the same with you !
My flavor of the day comment was not aimed at any one individual or company, rather to a person who spends more time changing out cables and chasing ghosts instead of listening to music.
My flavor of the day comment was not aimed at any one individual or company, rather to a person who spends more time changing out cables and chasing ghosts instead of listening to music.
Leporello
Well-known member
!!!
Hi mate, just wanted to add another 50cts worth on Nordost, since that's what I use.
The Leif series is there lowest end, so within that price range there's plenty more options. As you're well aware, it's all about synergy and finding the right balance. Your ears, your system = personal preference.
I will say this though, going back around 91/92, started with Monster, Cord Cobra, Kimber, MIT, Cardas, Van Den Hull and finally onto Audio Note, which had WBT connections on their interconnects, so that was nice! Around 98/99 one of my dealers recommended I try a flatline type cable that was completely unusual to anything I've come across. It was Nordost SPM reference which stands for Speed-power-musicality, talk about marketing! Anyway I tried it, and oh my! Then it was oh my on the price as well... so at the time I could only afford Red Dawn and Blue Heaven.
At first they were a bit on the bright side, speakers were Maggie's MG20 driven by VTL and Manley Labs tube amps. After a while things slowly settled but bright they were. So I changed over to a full Cardas loom and kept that until I ended up with the Apogee Diva's and Conrad johnson Premier 8A monoblocks, partnered with the ART preamp. Then I was able to get hold of the SPM cables once again, along with other Nordost accessories and that was it! Really tops!
Now this has all changed again, fast fwd to 2022, and they have the Norse series plus Supreme reference series, which is right up there! I certainly don't want to divulge in 30grand cables at this stage, since we're in a bit of a recession at the moment, plus other priorities in life, such as dental checks... So I settled for what I can afford, Nordost Frey2 with Tyr2 speaker cables, partnered with CJ amplification driving CLX's, it's at a supreme level compared to anything I had.
However, I have tried the Valhalla and Odin cables and all I can say is, those are in a completely different league. Can't afford it now but one day I'll get there! Step by step...
What these cables partnered with ML full range stats is unbelievable! Sometimes I do wonder if all this stuff is voodoo or science but when you do actually hear it for yourself, it was very very hard for me to return those cables.
So when you say Nordost Leif is bright, yes their lower end series has this tendency, most probably due to the silver plating on top of copper. In their top tier cables, starting with the Norse series, it's all about micro mono-filament and dual mono filament tech, plus the specific FEP dielectric they use... like I said must be voodoo...
At the end of the day, I thought to myself what's the point in trying to measure all this jazz, I don't even know where to start, so might as well just try one to listen first and then make judgements... And wow! Did I listen... simply outstanding level of performance! There's only a handful that can truly compete at this level. However, it costs a bloody fortune! I guess it's their pricing structure because of their products being so labour intensive and still made in the USA not China! It takes 8 hours to make just 1 meter of their micro mono filament cables, obviously not made anywhere else I guess.
If by any or the slightest chance you ever get to try either the Frey2 or Tyr2 or even the Valhalla series, you'll understand straight away what I'm referring to.
Hope your cables search goes well! As you can tell I've lost the plot with Nordost, it's being my preference for decades.
Cheers, and keep those fine tunes playing!
RJ
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One more small point of 50cts worth;
It obviously depends on system gear and especially the speakers, without a doubt.
For example, when I had the CLSIIz's driven by CJ's Premier 11A and a VTL preamp, the Nordost Red Dawn speaker cables & Blue Heaven interconnects, although quite good, still had a slight tingy bright affect that Andrew.H is referring to. So I switched over to Cardas and they were a better match in all areas, including speed, so not too shabby.
However, that very same gear was used on Quad ESL's, and the Nordost Red Dawn + Blue Heaven combo proved to be better still! I'm not sure what it was to be honest but it's definitely system dependent, and I was going in circles, trying all sorts of combos. One would deliver better LF detail whiles smearing the highs, whiles others were incredibly transparent in the midrange but lacked bass layering, if that makes sense.
Finally shifting to the higher end of Nordost is definitely a different dimension altogether! And so is the price... if only they were bit more affordable, just a tad bit!
Cheers, RJ
It obviously depends on system gear and especially the speakers, without a doubt.
For example, when I had the CLSIIz's driven by CJ's Premier 11A and a VTL preamp, the Nordost Red Dawn speaker cables & Blue Heaven interconnects, although quite good, still had a slight tingy bright affect that Andrew.H is referring to. So I switched over to Cardas and they were a better match in all areas, including speed, so not too shabby.
However, that very same gear was used on Quad ESL's, and the Nordost Red Dawn + Blue Heaven combo proved to be better still! I'm not sure what it was to be honest but it's definitely system dependent, and I was going in circles, trying all sorts of combos. One would deliver better LF detail whiles smearing the highs, whiles others were incredibly transparent in the midrange but lacked bass layering, if that makes sense.
Finally shifting to the higher end of Nordost is definitely a different dimension altogether! And so is the price... if only they were bit more affordable, just a tad bit!
Cheers, RJ
Ok folks I’m not sure this response is going to have any earth shattering info but I'm just going to throw it out there to show my results in my system on 4 different sets of cables and I have a 5th set of silver resolutions coming from Frank at Signal Cable in 3 weeks or so.
My system is Oddysey speakers with new panels (80) hours on them
Krell KSA 100MkII AMP
Backert Labs Rhumba 1.2 preamp
Rega RP8 TT Dynavector 17D3 cart
Allnic H-1201 phono pre
Oppo SACD player
Benchmark DAC3 HGC DAC Blue Sound Node 2i streamer
All Morrow IC cables
The 4 sets of speaker cables I’ve tried over the last 3 months from least liked to best I’ve heard in this system
1) Sanders DIY MOGAMI 3082 cables. These only lasted 5 days in the system it was all I could take. There was nothing I liked about these cables lifeless and dull.
2) Bluejeans Belden 5T00UP with their locking bananas. These sounded pretty good but in the end were just the opposite of the Sanders, they were a touch too bright for me.
3) Jon Risch cross connected DIY cables. I like these a LOT very nice clarity good tight bass really no complaints at all with these. I thought the search was over with these but nope!
4) Clear Day Silver single run cables. First off I want to say you can’t get these cables any more. Paul Laudati the owner of the company and builder of all the Clear Day cables isn’t with us any more, Cancer took him out of the game a few years back at only 60. Believe me when I tell you Paul was one of the nicest most informative people in the audio business, he is sorely missed. Ok so Like I had said earlier I have a pair of Silver Resolution Cables being made by Frank at Signal Cables. So I was thinking last night hey I have 2 pairs of those Clear Day cables here I’m not using I should put those in the system to see how they sound so I hooked them up this morning and I’ve been listening for 4 hours now and I was totally shocked. I’ve listened to them thru the streamer/DAC, and the SACD player so far, and I have no idea what the inductance, resistance, capacitance is on these cables but holy cow the beautiful sound coming out of these speakers is just absolutely RIGHT on this system. Crystal clear high end and nice tight low frequencies with a seriously wide sound stage. It’s going to be interesting to hear the Silver Resolution cables when I get them. I’ll add the comments on those when they get here.
My system is Oddysey speakers with new panels (80) hours on them
Krell KSA 100MkII AMP
Backert Labs Rhumba 1.2 preamp
Rega RP8 TT Dynavector 17D3 cart
Allnic H-1201 phono pre
Oppo SACD player
Benchmark DAC3 HGC DAC Blue Sound Node 2i streamer
All Morrow IC cables
The 4 sets of speaker cables I’ve tried over the last 3 months from least liked to best I’ve heard in this system
1) Sanders DIY MOGAMI 3082 cables. These only lasted 5 days in the system it was all I could take. There was nothing I liked about these cables lifeless and dull.
2) Bluejeans Belden 5T00UP with their locking bananas. These sounded pretty good but in the end were just the opposite of the Sanders, they were a touch too bright for me.
3) Jon Risch cross connected DIY cables. I like these a LOT very nice clarity good tight bass really no complaints at all with these. I thought the search was over with these but nope!
4) Clear Day Silver single run cables. First off I want to say you can’t get these cables any more. Paul Laudati the owner of the company and builder of all the Clear Day cables isn’t with us any more, Cancer took him out of the game a few years back at only 60. Believe me when I tell you Paul was one of the nicest most informative people in the audio business, he is sorely missed. Ok so Like I had said earlier I have a pair of Silver Resolution Cables being made by Frank at Signal Cables. So I was thinking last night hey I have 2 pairs of those Clear Day cables here I’m not using I should put those in the system to see how they sound so I hooked them up this morning and I’ve been listening for 4 hours now and I was totally shocked. I’ve listened to them thru the streamer/DAC, and the SACD player so far, and I have no idea what the inductance, resistance, capacitance is on these cables but holy cow the beautiful sound coming out of these speakers is just absolutely RIGHT on this system. Crystal clear high end and nice tight low frequencies with a seriously wide sound stage. It’s going to be interesting to hear the Silver Resolution cables when I get them. I’ll add the comments on those when they get here.
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ejspain
Well-known member
Pics of my DIY Mogami w3104. LOVE the natural, unaltered, pureness of this cable. I've had blue jean, cardas, naim audio, and audioquest and none sounded as transparent or balanced as the Mogami.
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andrew.hendler
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I really enjoyed the Mogami 3103; it was my second favorite of all the cables I tried: pro and audiophile.
Ultimately I settled on Canare 4s11, as I found it a little smoother than the Mogami. The Mogami had more sparkle. It's completely subjective which one you prefer. I wonder if I liked the 4s11 more because it was star quad; if that's the case - maybe I would have preferred the 3104 if I had tried it.
Anyhow, both cables are exceedingly neutral and well extended from top to bottom. I've been using the Canare now for weeks and love it.
I ended up getting a pair of both the Canare and Mogami made by performance audio. Even with carbon colored tech flex, cable pants, and locking carbon fiber adorned bananas - it's very reasonably priced. Your cables look great - I just haven't built cables in years. Performance Audio was a good option for me to get really aesthetically nice cables that look great and sound great.
Thanks all for your opinions on this thread!
Ultimately I settled on Canare 4s11, as I found it a little smoother than the Mogami. The Mogami had more sparkle. It's completely subjective which one you prefer. I wonder if I liked the 4s11 more because it was star quad; if that's the case - maybe I would have preferred the 3104 if I had tried it.
Anyhow, both cables are exceedingly neutral and well extended from top to bottom. I've been using the Canare now for weeks and love it.
I ended up getting a pair of both the Canare and Mogami made by performance audio. Even with carbon colored tech flex, cable pants, and locking carbon fiber adorned bananas - it's very reasonably priced. Your cables look great - I just haven't built cables in years. Performance Audio was a good option for me to get really aesthetically nice cables that look great and sound great.
Thanks all for your opinions on this thread!
Sounds like you found a wining combination! Now just sit back and enjoy those fine tunes!
Cheers, RJ
Cheers, RJ
*sorry I spelt "winning" wrong...
Must be the
cheers, RJ
Must be the
cheers, RJI'll have some chianti.*sorry I spelt "winning" wrong...
Must be the
..Silversmith Fideliums..I’ve done the speaker cable A/B’ing ad infinitum and the Fideliums are something truly special..
https://www.enjoythemusic.com/magaz..._Audio_Fidelium_Loudspeaker_Cables_Review.htm
https://www.enjoythemusic.com/magaz..._Audio_Fidelium_Loudspeaker_Cables_Review.htm
Really cool design, seems logical. The price is very fair too when you compare to other cables. Those really must be light. What cables had you previously been using before these? What speakers are you using them on?
"Has anyone experienced this phenomenon, where if you raise a speaker wire off the floor it sounds better or different?
"He points out that the waveguide physics model explains very nicely why interconnect, loudspeaker, digital, and power cables do affect sound quality. And further, it can also be used to describe and understand other sonic cable mysteries, like why cables can sound distinctly different after they have been cryogenically treated, or when they are raised off the floor and carpet."
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I have a full loom of Nordost O2 now but started with F2 then T2 then V2 then Odin. Each time I wanted to stop but the next level was just that much better and my CLX’s kept saying give me more. Recently I auditioned the new Odin Gold. Settled on one PC feeding my QB8. It was a big jump up. Looking at adding some more but need to save up for that to happen. When Nordost came to my place they connected 4-PC’s , two set of interconnects and then speaker cables. Just sounded so good can’t get how good out of my memory.
