Sanders ESL Amplifiers

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kach22i

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Current! Stats love current! One of the reasons I felt my Coda Continuum #8 had better control over my Prodigy than the Krell FPB600 it replaced. The Coda outputs 150 amperes of current. Double the current output of the mighty Krell. (And it’s much lighter)
I never head of Coda before your post, and looked it up.

Sounds very interesting.

I also looked into Innersound and Sanders amps, nothing on the resale market, people must be keeping them.
 

wink

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I never head of Coda before your post, and looked it up.

Sounds very interesting.

I also looked into Innersound and Sanders amps, nothing on the resale market, people must be keeping them.
There are a few on USAudiomart.com, but all in all they are difficult to find. Great amps, really good preamps, and an extremely good integrated. Coda Technology manufactures Sanders amps and preamps for Sanders, which is why you see such a similarity between the two. Legacy Audio amps are really good as well….if you can find them.
 

Robert D

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There are a few on USAudiomart.com, but all in all they are difficult to find. Great amps, really good preamps, and an extremely good integrated. Coda Technology manufactures Sanders amps and preamps for Sanders, which is why you see such a similarity between the two. Legacy Audio amps are really good as well….if you can find them.
How does the cost of Coda compare to Sanders? Im guessing Coda is more expensive but basically the same thing? Does Coda offer the lifetime warranty like Sanders?
 

wink

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How does the cost of Coda compare to Sanders? Im guessing Coda is more expensive but basically the same thing? Does Coda offer the lifetime warranty like Sanders?
Coda has more amplifier offerings than Sanders, so their pricing is rangier (is that a word?) than Sanders. CODA
Coda offers a 10yr warranty to 1st owner and 5 year to 2nd owner. Quite substantial in their own right.
 

Leporello

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As far as Sanders panel being indestructible and arc proof, remember that Roger's ESL is only driving high frequency, so without the high amplitude Bass on the panels, they last a hell of a lot longer and much more durable. The Sanders 10C HF crossover is (I think) is 175hz and up...

Now as far as panels that are full range and indestructible, one only has to look at Acoustat Panels... don't know how, but Jim Strickland nailed it.

Not to take anything away from Roger...as far as I am concerned, Roger Sanders and Jim Strickland are The "Real Deals" in the ESL world.......
Acoustat used "sheathed conductor" stators, insulated wire attached to a honeycomb structure, very similar to a Speaker Builder project using florescent light diffusors. If an arc forms, the voltage drop tends to redistribute so that most of it appears across the insulation, extinguishing the arc, as they explained in their literature. As long as the wire's dielectric breakdown voltage is well above the bias voltage, all is good. I think the diaphragms were just coated with graphite.

I don't know what became of Jim Strickland after Acoustat was bought by Haffler, then Haffler was bought by someone else, then both faded out of existence. Maybe someone can update.
 

Robert D

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Acoustat used "sheathed conductor" stators, insulated wire attached to a honeycomb structure, very similar to a Speaker Builder project using florescent light diffusors. If an arc forms, the voltage drop tends to redistribute so that most of it appears across the insulation, extinguishing the arc, as they explained in their literature. As long as the wire's dielectric breakdown voltage is well above the bias voltage, all is good. I think the diaphragms were just coated with graphite.

I don't know what became of Jim Strickland after Acoustat was bought by Haffler, then Haffler was bought by someone else, then both faded out of existence. Maybe someone can update.
Whats your opinion on washing panels? So many on here do it and report great success. To me, it seems like the wrong thing to do but you can't argue with the empirical evidence. Russ Knotts here in Ohio, the guy that repairs panels, told me that washing is a bad idea and that confirmed my suspicion. Washing should take off some of the coating on the panels? Is the coating on Martin Logans water soluble? We've had some members use simple green, I think even undiluted, and report success.Youd think thst would strip off a lot of the coating on the mylar. Really makes me think that my thought that washing is bad is probably wrong. What are your thoughts?
 

Leporello

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Radial now owns Hafler? Donno where Acoustat is now tho...
Yes, thanks. I knew it was some big pro audio outfit but don't remember who. I know David Haffler passed on years ago, but hadn't heard of his company in a long time. I guess it does still live on, though, in the pro audio market.
 

john65b

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The Martin Logan Panels supposedly have an "infused into Mylar" Coating that never washes off, while Acoustat panels have the coating that does wash off...

I washed off Acoustat panels before and promised myself not to do it again after much of the black coating came off...still worked great tho...
 

Robert D

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The Martin Logan Panels supposedly have an "infused into Mylar" Coating that never washes off, while Acoustat panels have the coating that does wash off...

I washed off Acoustat panels before and promised myself not to do it again after much of the black coating came off...still worked great tho...
I think the "infused into mylar" is something only the newer panels have?
 

Brandon Hartwick

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You can wash them no problem, tons of people have done it. Usually it's only done when they have a problem or are extremely dirty though, I used straight simple green and distilled water on mine about 5 months ago and they're still working great.
 

Russr

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You can wash them no problem, tons of people have done it. Usually it's only done when they have a problem or are extremely dirty though, I used straight simple green and distilled water on mine about 5 months ago and they're still working great.
Just to confirm - you sprayed (I'm assuming "misting" with straight/neat Simple Green", then rinsed off with distilled water?
I have an older pair of Aerius and one panel has developed an occasional "zzzt"...

Thanks

Russ
 

Robert D

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You can wash them no problem, tons of people have done it. Usually it's only done when they have a problem or are extremely dirty though, I used straight simple green and distilled water on mine about 5 months ago and they're still working great.
Do you see that the gain on the pre amp or receiver has to be turned up high in order to get the correct volume? My old worn out Prodigy panels were maxed out on my Marantz receiver, can't remember the number but it was over plus ten. Maybe washing them might have brought that number down, I never tried.

Did you observe the gain number before and after washing?
 

Leporello

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Whats your opinion on washing panels? So many on here do it and report great success. To me, it seems like the wrong thing to do but you can't argue with the empirical evidence. Russ Knotts here in Ohio, the guy that repairs panels, told me that washing is a bad idea and that confirmed my suspicion. Washing should take off some of the coating on the panels? Is the coating on Martin Logans water soluble? We've had some members use simple green, I think even undiluted, and report success.Youd think thst would strip off a lot of the coating on the mylar. Really makes me think that my thought that washing is bad is probably wrong. What are your thoughts?
I've never had occasion to try it, so I don't know from experience. But I wouldn't do it except as a last resort, accepting that if it didn't work I'd be ordering a new panel. But people do report success. Also, I wouldn't use anything but distilled water. Other users have reported using a cleaning agent (Simple Green), and wishing they hadn't.
 

JonFo

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I think the "infused into mylar" is something only the newer panels have?
Even the gen1 panels used a vapor-deposited process to ensure that the coating was thin and even. That creates a bond with the mylar that will survive a soft-water wash to get rid of surface deposits (dust, splashed 'stuff', bugs).

Not sure what the newer 'infused' process involves, but it sounds like it could be even more durable.
 

Robert D

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Even the gen1 panels used a vapor-deposited process to ensure that the coating was thin and even. That creates a bond with the mylar that will survive a soft-water wash to get rid of surface deposits (dust, splashed 'stuff', bugs).

Not sure what the newer 'infused' process involves, but it sounds like it could be even more durable.
The literature I got with my new Prodigy panels claimed the new panels are better.
 

Brandon Hartwick

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The literature I got with my new Prodigy panels claimed the new panels are better.
Of course it does lol, they gotta be able to justify the cost of replacement panels somehow. I'm sure there's some minor differences, but ESL panel technology hasn't really changed much since inception.
 

wink

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Of course it does lol, they gotta be able to justify the cost of replacement panels somehow. I'm sure there's some minor differences, but ESL panel technology hasn't really changed much since inception.
Relative to the original cost of the speaker you’re ordering the new panel for, and the cost of buying a new equivalent ML speaker. I think they are pretty reasonable considering they give you new speaker performance.
 
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