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DrJRapp

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I'm spinning my Summits off my theater system into it's own 2 channel high end music only system I've already decided that my amp will be a Pass Labs X150.5 and I am now searching for a preamp. Tubes have been recommended to me by almost everyone. One dealer suggestion has been that a Rogue Audio Magnum 99 is the way to go with ESLs. Does anyone have experience with any Rogue products?
 
I'm spinning my Summits off my theater system into it's own 2 channel high end music only system I've already decided that my amp will be a Pass Labs X150.5 and I am now searching for a preamp. Tubes have been recommended to me by almost everyone. One dealer suggestion has been that a Rogue Audio Magnum 99 is the way to go with ESLs. Does anyone have experience with any Rogue products?

Not with their pre-amps personally, but I did at one time use their M-120 Magnum monoblocks to drive my ReQuests. I was really happy with them, but had to part with them because they were just too hot in my old room. Mark O'Brien (owner of Rogue) used to use ReQuests to voice his electronics, so there is a certain synergy.

Joey V was auditioning a lower lever Rogue pre-amp at one time with his Summit/Plinius setup - I'll bet he chimes in.
 
My friend had a Rogue Metis and he had a huge ground-loop issue with it.... but he also has Klipsche horn speakers that have extremely high sensitivity.
 
Ground loop issues, generally point to other things going on...and are also very easy to fix with an isolation transformer...that shouldn't affect the perceived quality of a pre-amp, imo.
 
Well I never knew if it were a ground loop or some residual hum or something. I guess I should have bene more specific. The Rogue products are very well recieved in the HiFi community though and I would not personally hesitate to try one out :)
 
I'm spinning my Summits off my theater system into it's own 2 channel high end music only system I've already decided that my amp will be a Pass Labs X150.5 and I am now searching for a preamp. Tubes have been recommended to me by almost everyone. One dealer suggestion has been that a Rogue Audio Magnum 99 is the way to go with ESLs. Does anyone have experience with any Rogue products?

Am using Rogue M-150 monoblocks to drive my Aerius i's. Rogue makes great products and has world-class service.
 
I knew Mark O'Brien as a co-worker from a previous job while he and some associate were quietly developing the first chapter of Rogue Audio. Mark may have used a set of ReQuests but I know for a fact that he owned a pair of Monoliths that he used to always comment on how they made vocalists...well as Mark put it "He/She was right there"...undoubtedly wired into a pair of his pre-production Rogue Mono-blocks. Great guy by the way. Mark's closest associates were also co-workers and they ran a high tech circuit board manufacturing operation where we all worked. Price/Performance is very aggressive. Anyone see the newest addition, the Zeus? Physically, it is HUGE...

DrJ,
While I do not have any advice for your combination, I would recommend seeking a dealer who would lend you the preamp and audition it out at home. I do like the idea of the PASS Labs amp...I am looking at the same brand for amplification. I use Audio Research as my preamplifier with ReQuests.
 
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Add these to your list

Jerry,
The Summits mated with Pass X150.5 in a dedicated 2-channel audio system deserve the very best pre-amplifier you can find which will match with your preferences, given your budget. It's gonna take some work to audition pre-amps to find one that will make your system sing! Here are a few other pre-amplifiers to add to your list for auditioning in addition to the Rogue.
  1. Audio Research (SP16L, LS17, LS26)
  2. Balance Audio Tech
  3. Cary SLP-98
  4. Conrad Johnson
  5. DeHavilland (UltraVerve)
  6. Emotive Poeta
  7. Hovland HP100/200
  8. ModWright SWL9.0
  9. Wyetech Labs Pearl

You can read some of my posts (I think there's one in my system page) that I talked about my preamp quest. Of course, there are more preamps out there than mentioned above, but I've only listed the ones hovering around the price range of the Rogue you mentioned. Even then, this list is not complete but it is a start.

Good Luck
Spike
 
DrJ,
While I do not have any advice for your combination, I would recommend seeking a dealer who would lend you the preamp and audition it out at home. I do like the idea of the PASS Labs amp...I am looking at the same brand for amplification. I use Audio Research as my preamplifier with ReQuests.

The dealer will probably allow me to try it at home. That dealer sells both Pass and Rogue and it's the combination he recomends most often with ESLs and Planars.
 
Ground loop issues, generally point to other things going on...and are also very easy to fix with an isolation transformer...that shouldn't affect the perceived quality of a pre-amp, imo.

You are 100% correct, additionally the preamp mentioned is Rogue's entry level. The one I'm considering is the top end at 3 times the price. After all it is The Summit we are talking about...not a KHorn....lol
 
After all it is The Summit we are talking about...not a KHorn....lol
Exactly my point!! So why limit your choices to only Rogue and based on a dealer's recommendation? Why not audition to a bunch of them to figure out which is the best fit for your system, in your home?

Spike
 
Exactly my point!! So why limit your choices to only Rogue and based on a dealer's recommendation? Why not audition to a bunch of them to figure out which is the best fit for your system, in your home?

Spike


Simply because I live in South Florida the land of plug and play and HTIB. We have very few dealers that one can get to audition at and the product lines are just not here to be heard. As is I have to travel nearly 100 miles to hear the Rogue.
 
Hi Jerry,

I power my Vantages with Rogue's 99/90 pre/power combination, I'm pretty much biased ;) , but I can tell you that I'm extremely happy with this combination.
I've tried a few preamps to power the 90, and the 99 came out on top.
The sound is big, 3 dimensional and detail extraction is very good. It might not be the last word in dynamics and bass - but for a tubed pre & power combo at this price level, it certainly ranks up there with the best.
 
Axel
Thanks, that's exactly the feedback I'm looking for, an actual user rather than speculator!

Gotcha.... I had the Rogue Metis, Rogue Perseus, and the Rogue 99 hooked up to my Summits with the Plinius sa102 as the middleman.

As far as the Metis, I thought it was a very good entry level tube preamp! Very good performer, but as I got up the Rogue lineup, I noticed that they had a very similar sound to them... atleast it had this "sizzle", this spice that it adds to the music that made it sound a bit more directed at you.

Now, I never got around to a write up for the 99 vs the Cary Audio SLP-98, but I remember listening to the two in direct A/B for about 1 hour before deciding on the winner. Obviously, you will notice which one stayed per my sig.

The reason why the 98 sounds better is because it has a way fuller soundstage, instruments sound better, and isnt "thin" sounding which the 99 turned out to sound like after the A/B session. By "thin" I mean this in the centerfill and not the bass (I couldnt really tell the difference between the 2 in this aspect)... the 99 just had this unnatural feel that made it sound more like speakers and less like reality, especially evident in Ella Fitzgerald's Sleigh Ride when the trumpets come out from the R stage. Add to the "thin" feel, the sizzle, and I get this feeling that Frank Sinatra is "yelling at me".

The Cary 98 is a more natural performer... less "sizzle", not "thin", and a lot better in terms of build quality. The 99 has a very audible harmonic oddity through the Summits whenever I turn up the volume using the remote... and a tap on the chassis results in reverb through the Summits, bad microphonics. The Cary is far quieter, point to point wiring, easy access to the tubes for tube rolling.... which is my next report as I just recently tube rolled from the China stock tubes to some NOS Sylvania 6sn7gtb!

Anyway, I like the solidity of vocal imaging far too good on the Cary 98, moreso than on the 99. Add to that a more natural sound all across the board on the 98 and a seemingly more lush centerfill and more coherently put-together soundstage. Lastly, add to that the solid build of the 98, and it was a no brainer for me and my Summits.

Next up is the Cary 05 for Christmas 07... that has a nice ring to it doesnt it?

Anyway, here are some pics since everyone likes pics!

DSC00944.jpg

DSC00946.jpg

DSC00949.jpg

DSC00951.jpg


Good luck, Jerry! I will add this, the Perseus (2nd top from the line) was a pretty good performer, I thought it was the sweet gem of Rogue's lineup. I didnt find the 99 to be that much better for what you pay over the Perseus. Also, you should know that Rogue is coming out with a new top of the line pre.
 
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Not with their pre-amps personally, but I did at one time use their M-120 Magnum monoblocks to drive my ReQuests. I was really happy with them, but had to part with them because they were just too hot in my old room. Mark O'Brien (owner of Rogue) used to use ReQuests to voice his electronics, so there is a certain synergy.

Joey V was auditioning a lower lever Rogue pre-amp at one time with his Summit/Plinius setup - I'll bet he chimes in.

Good call Tim! It was only a matter of time before I'd show up. And correction... I auditioned all of Rogue's preamps. Back when I was on Psych rotation and things were easy and laid back. :(
 
Thanks Joey...I value your input. I'm sure the Cary 98 is good, but I could never allow it's build it yourself tinker toy look in one of the prime rooms in our new home. I'm avoiding all preamps that have the tubes sticking out the top because as functional as that may be for tube rolling it has a goofy look that I could never get over. This may sound hypacritical to you since I own a Shanling CDT100 that has the tubes sticking out the top, however that piece is a work of art anbd doesn't look homemade at all.
 
Thanks Joey...I value your input. I'm sure the Cary 98 is good, but I could never allow it's build it yourself tinker toy look in one of the prime rooms in our new home. I'm avoiding all preamps that have the tubes sticking out the top because as functional as that may be for tube rolling it has a goofy look that I could never get over. This may sound hypacritical to you since I own a Shanling CDT100 that has the tubes sticking out the top, however that piece is a work of art anbd doesn't look homemade at all.

Ahh... that's where we differ. I like preamps with tubes showing. Besides, I thought the Cary wasnt going to be as nice and hefty as it was in person (when I was viewing it in pics before).
 
My opinion of the SLP-98 differs from Joey's.
I've had them both in my house for an audition, and the 99 came out on top.
This could be a simple case of synergy, the 99 was just a better match to the Stereo 90 then the SLP-98.
The 99 was much more dynamic and had a bigger and more fuller soundstage.
The SLP-98 was more laid back, and lacked some detail.
On the other hand, the SLP-98 had a more natural sound than the 99.

Pre/power matching is extremely important. A preamp may sound amazing in one system and sound less than good in another system - you just have to listen for yourself and decide...
 
Ahh... that's where we differ. I like preamps with tubes showing. Besides, I thought the Cary wasnt going to be as nice and hefty as it was in person (when I was viewing it in pics before).


Joey, I know what you mean........ ahhhhhhhh the glow of the tubes !!

Unless one has kids close by, I don't care how "prime" the room is they all have that warm beauty attached to them !!
 

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