Logan Lust and Budget Limitations. Used vs New

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Paul,

Regarding Spike’s suggestions Aeon-i & SL3. I suspect both of these might be a good fit for you. As for the Aeon-is, I loved mine until I traded them in for the Vantages. The As sounded, well, somewhat sweeter than the Vs. The highs were not quite as extended, the bass did not go as low and had less punch and definition. But e.g. voices male and female, alto saxophone, horns in general, or violins, all sounded fabulous.

In contrast, the Vs are more “neutral” in my opinion. They are more versatile, can sound energetic or laid back, as the music demands. The As were leaning towards the laid back side. The Vs can rock if needed, the As not so much. Which, given your preferences, might be just right.

A guy I knew a couple of years ago had listened to Vantages and Ascent-is, and chose the Ascents. His description of the differences between the two was very similar to mine. But what was a weakness to me was a strength to him, and vice versa. You might feel the same way.

Now regarding the SL3s, they have pre-XStat panels like the Aeons, so they should sound a little warmer than the Vs. And IIRC the crossover frequency from the bass to the panel is much lower. (270Hz vs 450Hz? Not sure, and too lazy to look it up now.) The lower xover frequency should help bass/panel integration. I have not heard SL3s, so this is just a theory. However, a problem I had with the Aeons was the height of the singer’s voice with respect to e.g. a guitar. I sounded like a very short singer played that guitar right under his chin. There just was not enough height distance between voice and guitar. I suspect that the high over frequency of the Aeons is responsible. The Vantages are not much better in this respect. If memory serves, they cross over only 50 Hz lower than the Aeons. The 1.6QR Maggies are better here. Their cover is in the treble region, which creates different issues. They also tend to bloat the individual acoustic events within the sound stage into bigger halos, making them sound larger than they should be. Both Aeons and Vantages can recreate a more believable reproduction. The SL3 might beat both in terms of sound stage height reproduction (unconfirmed theory). The Aeon-i also has a conventional dome tweeter in the cabinet back well which is intended to bounce more high frequencies off the front wall and increase the perception of spaciousness. That tweeter can be defeated, which is what I did. It may be useful in some rooms or please some tastes. Did anyone read all the way down to here? Sorry about the verbosity.
 
Stuwee and Raflar:

Thanks so much- every time I visit this site, I learn something (s) new. Greatly appreciated! One of my obvious concerns is having to replace the 'stat panels on such "vintage" speakers as the SL3 or Aerius. I am scheduled to audition the Aeon i this week, likely tomorrow, Friday, and will report back. I have not ruled out selling my Magneplanar MMGs and stepping into a pair of 1.6, or more likely, the .7's.

Once I've listened to the Aeon's I'll have a much better sense the path I will take. The seller is a savvy audio guy which raises my comfort level. He is a non-smoker as well.

More later.

Oh, Raflar, I sure did read to the end of your post. :)
 
Aerius i vs Aeon i

These are available locally. Asking price for Aerius is $600, and for the Aeon's $1100- Your thoughts? Both are supposedly in fine condition, except for the obvious age of the Aerius.
I don't want to be- pardon the cliche'- "penny wise and pound foolish. Replacement panels are close in price for both models.

Thanks,
Paul
 
Hi Paul,
Given the choices between Aerius & Aeon, I would not get the Aerius due to the fact that it's just an older version of the Aeon. If I had to consider an older Logan (from your stated choices) for your room size, I'd go for the SL3 for the slightly bigger panel, 10" woofer and lower crossover frequency. Otherwise, I'd stick with the Aeon. Good Luck!
 
A decision reached. Not what I anticipated....

I was able to spend considerable time yesterday auditioning Aeon i's as well as a pair of Vistas. Each set of speakers was powered by excellent tube gear. The speakers looked and sounded gorgeous- I actually preferred the Aeons because the soundstage did not "shrink" as much when I stood up from the seated sweet spot. Also, the Vistas sounded a bit "cooler" to me- but it could have been the source material.

On my trip home, I thought long and hard about the Aeons- and thought some more. When I returned to my listening room, I gave my Sonus Fabers a "serious" workout for the entire evening, listening to vinyl and Spotify- many different genres of music.

The ML's do some things "better" than the Liutos, , the Liutos do some things better than the Aeons'. I was tired of thinking about it, and went to bed. After "sleeping on the matter" I've decided to keep what I already have. I think the biggest factor is that my speakers (including the MMG's) are a bit warmer than the Aeon's and that's something I prefer. The Logans sounded, at times, more analytical, a quality that I felt would, for me, be eventually tiring. I also felt that my golden-eared wife, would find the Logan's too detailed. She prefers the MMG's to the Liutos for that very reason.

If I had sufficient discretionary funds, I would have purchased the Aeon's while keeping the Fabers and MMG's. The Aeon's still fascinate me.

I've learned a lot here and thank all of you for responding to my questions, and addressing my concerns. I will visit here occasionally to see what you guys are up to.

Be well and good listening.

Paul
 
I think the biggest factor is that my speakers (including the MMG's) are a bit warmer than the Aeon's and that's something I prefer. The Logans sounded, at times, more analytical, a quality that I felt would, for me, be eventually tiring. I also felt that my golden-eared wife, would find the Logan's too detailed. She prefers the MMG's to the Liutos for that very reason.
This is the main reason for my preference of the older panels. The new XStat panels are lightning fast and transparent, but there's just that 'magic' with the ReQuests that offer the underlying 'tone' which appeals to me moreso than the newer panels. I did not mention this in my previous post so that you would not be biased one way or another before your audition. Given your findings with the Aeons, I am certain that the SL3 will be much more to your liking. Like you, I had the Magnepan 1C for 10 years before upgrading to the ReQuests. From my (old and fading) memories, when directly compared to the ReQuests, I felt that the Magnepan 1C were overly warm and a bit sluggish. But you'd only come to notice the differences in a direct comparison, though.
By the way, the SF Liuto monitor are good speakers, but at 86db sensitivity, I think your tube amps may be underpower to drive them to their full potential.

Best of luck with your search,
Spike
 
This is the main reason for my preference of the older panels. The new XStat panels are lightning fast and transparent, but there's just that 'magic' with the ReQuests that offer the underlying 'tone' which appeals to me moreso than the newer panels. I did not mention this in my previous post so that you would not be biased one way or another before your audition. Given your findings with the Aeons, I am certain that the SL3 will be much more to your liking. Like you, I had the Magnepan 1C for 10 years before upgrading to the ReQuests. From my (old and fading) memories, when directly compared to the ReQuests, I felt that the Magnepan 1C were overly warm and a bit sluggish. But you'd only come to notice the differences in a direct comparison, though.
By the way, the SF Liuto monitor are good speakers, but at 86db sensitivity, I think your tube amps may be underpower to drive them to their full potential.

Best of luck with your search,
Spike

Hi Spike:

Aha! More good info. Thanks. I tried to go to the audition with no expectations, and I think I was successful. The Aeons would likely sound different, one way or the other, in my listening room, with my gear, etc., but this is not a logistical possibility. I have not closed the door on ML's and may audition the SL3 if they're still available. The MMG's cost me $300 bux and even though I had to repair them, I think they're pretty darn capable. Slower than the Logans for sure, warmer, yep. Enjoyable to listen to? You bet.

RE: the SF Liuto 86db sensitivity. My tube amps are quite stout- conservatively rated @120 WPC into 8 Ohms. In short, they've "got balls." Powered by those amps, the Liutos are plenty quick, transparent, and have surprisingly decent low frequency response- and I can play them much louder than I'd ever want to without ill effects. I've got Tube Traps in the front corners and will add treatment to first reflection points on the side walls as well as on the ceiling. And possibly additional bass treatment in the rear wall corners top, and bottom. Overall, and IMHO, the Liutos are over-achievers.

After many years, I continue to love this hobby and continue to learn more, which enhances my listening enjoyment even further.
 
I bought a 1 year old pair of Theos on ebay for $1800. Deals are out there. Keep your eyes peeled.
 
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