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How come ML didnt make Stereophile's latest Class A list?

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Joey_V

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Here's the list:
(1) Avantgarde Uno 3.0: $11,970 - $13,970 / pair
(2) Aerial Acoustics Model 20T: $24k - $29k / pair
(3) B&W 802D: $12,000 / pair
(4) Focal-JMLab Grande Utopia Be: $85k / pair
(5) Focal-JMLab Nova Utopia Be: $37,500 / pair
(6) Innersound Kaya: $20k / pair
(7) mbl 101E Radialstrahler: $46,900 / pair
(8 )NHT Evolution T6: $4000/system
(9)Peak Consult Empress: $25,000 / pair
(10) Revel Ultima Studio: $15k / pair
(11) Rockport Technologies Merak II / Sheritan II: $34,500 / pair
(12) Sonus Faber Stradivari: $40,000 / pair
(13) Triangle Magellan: $35,900 /pair
(14) Wilson Audio Specialties MAXX Series 2: $44,900 / pair
(15) Wilson Audio Specialties WATT/Puppy System 7: $22,400 / pair

Is it because they havent reviewed any of the newer ML stuff?
 

MiTT

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I'm sure it's because they haven't reviewed anything lately from ML. I know that they only add a component to their "Recommended Components" list if they've reviewed it.
 

aliveatfive

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Don't know why, but the audiophile press in the US has been slow to review the latest from ML. No indication from 'Phile when it might be reviewed. Only US review is a poorly written (in my opinion) review in TAS.
 
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dyazdani

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It's because they aren't any good - you should bring your Summits and leave them with me so you can get something else... :D
 

aliveatfive

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That's really, REALLY, funny. Hope you have some better material.
 

Joey_V

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dyazdani said:
It's because they aren't any good - you should bring your Summits and leave them with me so you can get something else... :D
Wait a minute.... I sense sneakyness here..... :mad: .
 

Craig

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If they were on that list they would be the lowest priced speaker!
 

nirvanaseeker

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I've been out of following reviews for a long while and notice all speakers are megabucks. How is is possible to spend $85k on speakers?? I am unable to connect the dots. Are people really truly that nuts?
 

SteveInNC

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nirvanaseeker said:
I've been out of following reviews for a long while and notice all speakers are megabucks. How is is possible to spend $85k on speakers?? I am unable to connect the dots. Are people really truly that nuts?
For normal people, that would be nuts. The issue is one of lifestyle. For a significantly large number of people, spending $85k on speakers "doesn't matter" because of their sheer wealth. For example, the person that owns the company that I work for is personally worth several billion dollars. If he wanted those speakers, how hard do you think he'd have to think about it? There are 793 billionaires in the world, and estimates are that there are two million millionaires in the US alone. (For our British friends, the above is in US billion=1000000000).

Probably a majority of people would think that we here are insane for having $4k-plus invested in our complete systems. If you look at the "household income" poll in the Polls section of this forum, you'll see that the majority of owners here earn $75k or more, with the largest single sample in the $150k+ range (note, it's an un-scientific poll because it is self-selected, but still serves the point of this argument).

The list at the beginning of this thread seems centered roughly around $30k, with both $4k and $85k as outliers. Note that these are also the speakers that were considered the "best" without regard to cost, not necessarily the best value.

It's arguable if the incremental improvement in performance makes $85k speakers worth that much more than $10k speakers, but people have the right to spend their money on what they want, even if it seems ridiculous. Supercars cost ten-plus times what even nice sportscars cost, and at least in the US, you'd never be able to legally make use of that performance unless you're on a track. People still buy them, even if they are considerably impractical for typical use.
 

twich54

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nirvanaseeker said:
I've been out of following reviews for a long while and notice all speakers are megabucks. How is is possible to spend $85k on speakers?? I am unable to connect the dots. Are people really truly that nuts?
Hell, Dave Wilson's signature speakers list for $135,000 !!, Now if your the person with the big time seven figure home you aren't going to put a pair $10,000 Summitt's in it, are you ??
 
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ml360

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Maybe ML is not on the list cause they can be had at magnolia and tweeter :eek: (the thought of that still gets me sick).
 

twich54

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charliemike said:
I am not impressed with B&Ws at all.
Charlie, who mentioned B&W ???? Dave Wilson has nothing to do with B&W, he is the man behind Wilson Audio Speakers.
 
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rob725

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I first heard the Logans when auditioning the 802's, which sounded really good 'till I heard the ascents, then the 802's sounded like a box, but with really good bass. I'll take my Vantages for less than half the cost any day; heck, I'd choose the Vantages if the 802's were priced the same!
 
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alex

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the only reason they didn't have any ML on the recomended component list, is because ML is not as good advetiser as it used to be, money talks...
 

roberto

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alex said:
the only reason they didn't have any ML on the recomended component list, is because ML is not as good advetiser as it used to be, money talks...
Hola Alex...very good point...or they have not reviewed the new line of ML, as soon as they do it, you will see them at the chart...happy listening,
Pura vida,
Roberto.
 

MarkNewbie

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Boy is this going to start some controversy!

Simply put, I love the Martin Logan sound. I truly do. I want that out there first and foremost. I had dreamed of owning these speakers for many years. To me, they are a dream come true. Is Martin Logan the best? I highly doubt it. Common folks, think about it. If ML was the best, why would people buy Wilson, Sonus Faber, B&W, Innersound, or Avantgarde to name a few at such a higher cost? I don’t know what kind of reply Joey was seeking when he started this post but from me you’re going to get brutal honesty. I also realize that I am posting in “The Martin Logan Owners Club”. I would never expect anything but rave reviews of ML products here. I am an owner of Martin Logan too and I do love my speakers! Also, this is JUST my opinion and as we all know, that does not mean it is factual in any way, shape, or form. Had to throw the disclaimer out there for you legal eagles.

Now if I had the money (Steve made this point very eloquently), I would probably own the top of the line Wilsons. I have heard the Watt Puppys and the MAXX (earlier series) and they are phenomenal at the very least. But I don’t have that kind of jack laying around to throw into my music system. They would totally blow away my Ascent i’s and I have no doubt that they would make people think twice about the summits. I have listened to the 802Ds as well. I see people saying that they are not impressed with them but here again, I disagree! They sounded wonderful. Do I like my Ascent i’s better? Yes I do but just because of that, I am not going to say they didn’t sound great. The simple fact is that they are fantastic speakers as well. I see so much talk about coupling the right amp and pre with speakers yet everyone is raving about ML’s newest offering that has a built in amp. So ML has been able to couple the “perfect” amp with their speakers? You don’t seriously believe that, do you? Think about what is happening here. Doesn’t that totally change everything that we have put together? Isn’t the purpose of our systems make-up to offer that dynamic sound we have all been searching for? This is not much different than putting a puzzle together where the pieces are all the same color and only when coupled do they show you the picture. (Different pieces together give you different pictures.) That last sentence should be read over a couple of times to get the jest of it, please. Also, don’t get me wrong, I think the Summits do sound great. Do I think they sound that much better than my current setup? Nope! Does that mean that if you take the ML amp out of the summit and add your own, better amp, you get even better sound? I am just being devil’s advocate here. I can’t help but think that a Summit without the internal amp could be the best of all worlds. Let my carefully chosen system drive my carefully chosen speakers. I know that this is going to generate a plethora of comments and some are going to look at me as if I am some kind of traitor to this club but that is not the case. I do love the sound I get from my Ascent i’s even though I believe that they are lacking in bass and plan a sub in the near future. Do I plan on buying Summits? Nope. I am pretty darned happy with what I have. Do I think that it was the lack of advertising that kept ML out? Not going to say that is not possible but I have seen MLs included in Stereophile’s lesser ratings before so I am not convinced that is the case. I don’t recall (am old and could have missed something) seeing Avantgarde doing a lot or any advertising but they were included.

Ok fellow members, fire away at me. Just remember, I respect each and everyone of you and your opinions. Even if they are wrong! Hey, that last sentence was just joke! I was just kidding (ducking)! :eek:

And if your going to take a shot at me, please be gentle...
 

lugano

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Wow Mark ! First of all, thank you for sharing your thoughts in such a detailed manner. My take is that we're in love with Martin Logans. Personally, I'm in love with a lot of "things" made of metal, plastic, glass and wood, which have a specific purpose, but they are more to me than the sum of their parts. Macintoshes are a good example. Weber grills. Rado watches. We know their deficiencies, we know that there is "better" overall, but these products EXCEL in something. And this something is very important to us, not only, but also because it has become a part of our philosophy and our dream history. They are bricks in our happiness' wall. Should we be able to go back in time, as of today we know that here and there we would have acted differently, but not regarding these items. When I come home, I take a look at my ML's, smile, put a CD on and forget about most of the things that ruined my day. They are a friend.

oh, and Wilson loudspeakers are overrated and overpriced.
 

DTB300

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lugano said:
Weber grills.
Spoken by a true BBQer...
oh, and Wilson loudspeakers are overrated and overpriced.
Most are...right now I would say the Sohpia and the older Watt/Puppy are/were my favorites of the Wilson's. Heard the Maxx 2's the other day and was not impressed - especially for $45k

Dan
 
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