Changing the panel ?

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max

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Hi guys,
I was told to be careful when buying an used ML because of the panel that could have lost its functionalities and has to be changed...?!?
You know I'm a newbie in the ML world, so I need your help to better understand.
a) first of all, ... is it true?
b) if yes, is there a time after it is recommended to change the panel?
c) is there some evidence in the sound that suggests you to do it?
Massimo
 

roberto

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max said:
Hi guys,
I was told to be careful when buying an used ML because of the panel that could have lost its functionalities and has to be changed...?!?
You know I'm a newbie in the ML world, so I need your help to better understand.
a) first of all, ... is it true?
b) if yes, is there a time after it is recommended to change the panel?
c) is there some evidence in the sound that suggests you to do it?
Massimo
Hola Massimo and welcome to the club. Your ears will tell if there is a problem. When you have a bad panel, usually the highs are lost or some parts of the panel does not produce any sound at all. It is very difficult to say when they are going to fail and the reliability is very good on now days and even ten years ago. We have members that reports great sound from their Martin Logans with over 16 years and still working very nicelly. The sound of ML is so great that we, the ML users have this club. So listen carefully to them before make the purchase, and if they would need new panels, ask the replacement stat panels price prior the buy and make up your mind if it is a good buy instead a new model. Remember, trust your ears, happy listening,
Roberto.
 

JonFo

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max said:
Hi guys,
I was told to be careful when buying an used ML because of the panel that could have lost its functionalities and has to be changed...?!?
You know I'm a newbie in the ML world, so I need your help to better understand.
a) first of all, ... is it true?
b) if yes, is there a time after it is recommended to change the panel?
c) is there some evidence in the sound that suggests you to do it?
Massimo
Not necessarily, it all depends on how well the speakers have been treated over the years. For instance, I have a pair of '93 vintage Sequel II's (as my rears) that still sound great. I will replace the panels in early 'o7, but mostly because I'm compulsive about quality, not because I have to.

The typical issue with older panels is a high frequency roll off. Occasionally, some buzzes or resonances from spars that fail will set in; but generally nothing worse than the accumulation of dust and smoke particles on the Mylar.
Do listen to them before buying. If buying over the web, factor in at least 50% of the cost of a repanel into your total cost of acquisition if the speakers are >10 years old.

As for what to lsitne to, high frequency roll off is the first thing. However, unless you are intimate with a well balanced ML rig, you probably will think most panels are great. Which is fine, then once you get to learn how the panels sound in your room, you can decide if you want to upgrade.
As someone who recently replanled, it is immediately obvious how much better fresh panels are. But you only know it *after* you’ve done the repanel ;)
 

wink

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My ReQuests are 8 years old now and going strong. I've owned them since new and each year that goes by I think about repaneling....but I just cruise down to the local hifi shop and listen to new logans and change my mind( for another year anyway) If the speakers are well kept and not abused they'll last for a long, long time.

Good luck,

Dan :cool:
 

edwinr

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I've had a number of cone driver speakers over years and some I've had reliability problems with after only a couple of years. Maggies are much more prone to panel or ribbon tweeter damage than ML's are. Try the BBC LS3/5a. Those things are always popping a woofer. I've owned Klipsch speakers that have had mid and high range horns failing. ML have steadily improved the mylar panel structure over the years to the point where they're nearly bullet proof. So what I'm saying, is that ML's have far greater real world reliability than legend would have it. But like any older purchase, the ongoing reliability of any speaker depends on how the previous owner has treated them.
 
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K

karma

Guest
HI All,
Mine started life as CLSII's. I bought them around 1990. Upgraded them to the A version as soon as it was available. Bypassed the Z version. If it ain't broke, why fix it, right? Though getting a little long in the tooth, they sound great. I've noticed no sonic degradation.

Except one.

The right channel has been loosing sensitivity very slowly until now there is about a 3 dB difference in channel volume. Still, except for volume which can be easily balanced, the two channels sound identical.

I have just ordered replacement panels. I'm scared. The speakers currently sound so good that any change will have to be in the wrong direction. I guess I have done the right thing because there is no way to know how long my current panels will remain useful. But I'm still scared.

One thing. It takes no effort to remember breaking in my current CLS's. It took forever. In fact, I'm not at all sure they ever quit changing. To be sure, 80% of the break in happened in the first 100 hours. But I notice very small increments of change even now. They keep getting better; mellower, more dynamic.!!!! Yes. These speakers feel like an old pair of slippers but with real grit when necessary.

So, that's why I'm scared. I'm afraid I will never again hear what I'm now hearing--which is pure magic. These speakers are a sure fire cure for up-grade-itis.

Sparky
 
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Jeff Zaret

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Sparky,
When I changed mine I felt and still feel the magic is still there. Always good to be concerned but I believe you will be happy with the results.

BTW, the instructions state the panel change should be done with two people but can be accomplished by one. I did mine myself and it took a little effort but worked fine. You also get the "new" ML decal to put on the front of the panel too. :D

Jeff
 
A

Andre

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Anybody knows the cost of replacement panels for Aerius-i? Mine is 1997 production, however due to humidity (I think), panels deteriorate faster such that it start to lose highs and then loudness such that bass overwhelms the panel sound.....
 
K

karma

Guest
Jeff Zaret said:
Sparky,
When I changed mine I felt and still feel the magic is still there. Always good to be concerned but I believe you will be happy with the results.

BTW, the instructions state the panel change should be done with two people but can be accomplished by one. I did mine myself and it took a little effort but worked fine. You also get the "new" ML decal to put on the front of the panel too. :D

Jeff
HI Jeff,
Thanks for the encouragement. It helps. And the obvious upside is the new decal. That should ease my pain. :)

Sparky
 

amey01

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Andre said:
Anybody knows the cost of replacement panels for Aerius-i? Mine is 1997 production, however due to humidity (I think), panels deteriorate faster such that it start to lose highs and then loudness such that bass overwhelms the panel sound.....
I don't think Aerius panels are too expensive which is good! Have you tried vacuuming them really well first?
 
A

Andre

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Vacuum, wash, etc. Now trying out Enilsen's conductive coating method. What's the price of new Aerius panels?
 
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