adding tubes to the path...

[Jeff Zaret]

So what is the real difference using one of the tube buffers or having a tube preamp the CD player runs through?

Jeff

 

[aliveatfive]

Jeff -
Simple, IMHO. The better player uses a better platter mechanism and more sophisticated circuitry to achieve its goals. This player may use a tubed output stage for even better results. The cheaper player has faults that the better one does not. The tubed buffer attempts to cover the sins of using cheap electronics, but cannot completely succeed.

 

[Spike]

So what is the real difference using one of the tube buffers or having a tube preamp the CD player runs through?

Using tube buffers to smooth out (compensate for) what is considered as a weakness in a CD player is a patch at best. The CD player's analogue stage may be too weak to drive the signal and the tube buffer stage merely smooth things out to make it more listenable. And then this smoothed out signal is fed into a pre-amp acting as yet another buffering stage before the amplifiers. A good tube preamp is a much cleaner solution and provides less components in the signal chain to introduce distortion. Just my 2 cents...

Spike

 

[magoo]

This a quoted from a UK magazine, HiFi World, whose opinions I generally trust way more than most (they champion a lot of old kit as well as modern stuff, and they have a deep love of tube gear in general)..........

"It works by offering a very high output impedance, of about 500k, to the output stage (of a cd player for eg) driving it. This ensures that it has an incredibly easy load to drive, so that it will be able to perform opmtimally. It also offers a low output impedence, about 33Ohms, meaning it can drive almost any length of ic cable and any conceviable input loading from a commercially avaible amp. This combination effectively soothes the troublesome connection between cd spinner & amp input, allowing both to perform at their respective best."

"It injected no small degree of life into the system.....theres an air, space & dimensionallity which simply isnt there without it......Theres absolutely no discernable change in tonality, although it does improve on the texturality of acoustic instruments" (HIFI world, sept '04)

I've not heard one so cant make any comment personally, but MF have a fine reputation over this side of the pond, however this seems like a Roberto moment "trust in your ears"

BTW that review was based on adding the x-10v3 to a MF X-Dac (hooked up to a modified (by KI) Marantz CD63 KI player (Ken modded the ed's old player for him personally )

 

[Jeff Zaret]

Using tube buffers to smooth out (compensate for) what is considered as a weakness in a CD player is a patch at best. The CD player's analogue stage may be too weak to drive the signal and the tube buffer stage merely smooth things out to make it more listenable. And then this smoothed out signal is fed into a pre-amp acting as yet another buffering stage before the amplifiers. A good tube preamp is a much cleaner solution and provides less components in the signal chain to introduce distortion. Just my 2 cents...

Spike

Spike,
This is what I was alluding to. The less pieces in the chain the less possibility of altering the sound. I am also not saying that "tubed" CD players may not sound better or more open, more air, texture or what ever adjective you would use to describe it but .............I am not sure it is worth the cost and added circuitry for a minimal improvement. I would think that having a "good" CD player would be the goal whether or not it is SS or tube is a matter of choice. For example, if you have a mod'ed cd player or a tube CD and all SS equipment have you really gained what you are so desparately searcing to find?

I guess this may make me a minimalist ( ok Mark.... ) I would think like everything else in the chain of sound production and reproduction that less would be preferrable but "that is just my opinion and yours mileage may vary"

Jeff

 

[MarkNewbie]

<-----Not touching that one!!!!

 

[amey01]

I run the original X-10D (with ECC88 valves) with my Marantz SACD player and Primare Solid State amplification. I've found it to certainly be a worthwile upgrade. Sure, I wouldn't use it with an ultra-high end CD player (such as the T+A Valve unit I have my eye on), but between the Marantz and the Primare pre-amp it makes a very worthwile difference. The sound is fuller, richer and certainly more "tube like". The soundstage is wider and deeper. There is less grain in the upper frequencies. And the sound has a "drive" that is much more authoritative. That is not to say whether the tubes or the buffering is making the difference.

It is important to note that the X10-D (and X-10v3) are buffers first and foremost - they are NOT to add tubes to your signal chain or "cover the nasties" of a lesser CD player as some have been saying. The idea is that the CD player is relieved of the load of driving a preamp by driving the ultra high-impedance buffer input - possibly meaning it can perform better. In turn, the buffer drives the pre-amp with its tube output stage.

 

[DTB300]

i stumbled across a neat product today from Musical Fidelity. It is a tube buffer that is designed to be inserted into the musical chain at line levels.
it seems like an easy way to insert a tube stage just before my CLS amplifiers.

Visiting back on this topic...Here is some banter about the MF Tube Buffer product. Allen who does some great mods to CD Players makes a great point about this addition to a CD Player...

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/messages/216907.html

Dan