2021 new gen Apple tv 4k Dolby Atmos Problems

[Robert D]

Watched two Atmos movies yesterday on HBOMax and no issues. Did try to pause for a few minutes and recreate the issue I had with The Matrix but nothing. So I am back to the only time I have heard the major issues is within the Netflix App. Robert I binged the entire series For All Mankind just over the last two months; both seasons and never had an issue in that series. I've never experienced the volume issue either. My issues are what you hear in the videos I posted earlier. The last one in the movie The Matrix in HBOMax might have been a fluke or me losing it. LOL But I'll keep my ears open if something new pops up.

On For All Mankind, the audio just had a very short 1 sec or so series of pops almost like static. It happened only once, and it was last night. The rest of my family didn't even notice it. They've never heard the problem, only me. I hone my ears in for listening for the problem.

So we are just starting season 2 and the problem only happened once and for 1 sec. It's still there nonetheless. Over the summer I was watching See on Apple tv + and it happened all of the time. Loud static sounds that sounded as if they could damage my speakers. Sound never dropped though. When I got my new Apple box the problem went away. Now I hear it again. Never updated the OS either. Maybe the apps themselves updated? I didn't shut off updates on those. Wondering if maybe an updated app needs the updated OS to work right.

 

[IraG]

Well, I'm still using the pre 15 OS and had the audio drop out watching Netflix two nights ago. So it's not the newest OS, 15 because I've had it now.

To top it off, last night I heard the familiar clicking noise while watching For All Mankind on Apple TV +. The audio didn't do the full drop out, just the static clicking sound I've heard in the past. I also heard a 1 second interval of that watching Netflix 2 days ago before the audio cut out. I figured the audio would cut out last night on Apple tv+ but it did not.

So I thought for sure 100% this was a hardware issue possibly with early units, but now I know I was wrong. My replacement box was flawless but not any longer. I'm at a complete loss now. None of it makes sense. Just going to have to live with this as it is, shut off the Atmos, or throw the thing in the trash. I don't think they will fix this, really. I spent thousands installing nice ML speakers in the ceiling for Atmos, so I'm not turning it off.

Is it possible that the fault lies with the streaming service itself? Has anyone tried streaming the same show on a different device in Atmos right after the Apple had an incident? Has anyone been able to duplicate the sound issue on a different device? If that happens, then we know it might lie in the streaming service itself. I have not been able to duplicate this in any other device. My Amazon doesn't have this problem. I'm starting to feel like a fool for even sticking with the Apple tv when I have the Amazon that works fine. Anyone know if Amazon added Atmos for Netflix?

We will have to agree to disagree on whether or not there was ever a H/W issue. My replacement ATV4k does not have the Atmos issue present in my launch day unit. My gen 1 ATV4k had no Atmos issues ever, so that would tend to rule out S/W and tvOS.

If your Atmos problem returned just recently, without any changes to S/W, then I would look closer at what else might have changed or be causing the issue. As I suggested, it could be network congestion as more people are streaming over the holidays. I would wait a week and see if the problem goes away on its own.

I believe the problem may be that the 2nd gen ATV4k is sensitive to timing or streaming irregularities, perhaps related to background tasks. Though Apple generally optimizes their software for their hardware, perhaps a streaming device is out of their area of expertise. I can't imagine that Apple would put their best resources on what is likely one of their lowest performing product lines.

 

[Robert D]

I can't imagine that Apple would put their best resources on what is likely one of their lowest performing product lines.

That's my thoughts too. It's as if the Apple tv device is an after thought for them. Sad though since the Amazon Firestick seems to work better and costs less than $75.

 

[JonFo]

That sure sounds like what it could be. How can they fix that? Its just software?

I'm guessing it is largely software, as if it was hardware, the bug would be repeatable and occur on all services.

Now, the question is which software, the OS or the App, or both ?

Having managed software/firmware roll-outs for decades, one can easily have a good App implementation on OS version X, but then issues when OS version Y comes out. Those 'issues' might be A) bugs in the OS, or B) bugs in the App being exposed by the new OS (changes to timing is a common root cause).

It is easy for App vendors and OS vendors to wind up in a bug-loop where for a period, the source and fixes of bugs swap sides. But eventually, everything calms down and works (until the next major release, of course )

Theoretically, the Netflix App might have worked fine on TVOS 14, which allowed up to a 250ms 'gap' in the audio stream from the App before forcing a MAT re-sync at the lower layers, and then TVOS 15 now only allows for a 200ms 'gap' in audio before the re-synch. Again, this conjecture on my part, as it's a useful example of the corner cases that might occur in real-life.

 

[Robert D]

I'm guessing it is largely software, as if it was hardware, the bug would be repeatable and occur on all services.

Now, the question is which software, the OS or the App, or both ?

Having managed software/firmware roll-outs for decades, one can easily have a good App implementation on OS version X, but then issues when OS version Y comes out. Those 'issues' might be A) bugs in the OS, or B) bugs in the App being exposed by the new OS (changes to timing is a common root cause).

It is easy for App vendors and OS vendors to wind up in a bug-loop where for a period, the source and fixes of bugs swap sides. But eventually, everything calms down and works (until the next major release, of course )

Theoretically, the Netflix App might have worked fine on TVOS 14, which allowed up to a 250ms 'gap' in the audio stream from the App before forcing a MAT re-sync at the lower layers, and then TVOS 15 now only allows for a 200ms 'gap' in audio before the re-synch. Again, this conjecture on my part, as it's a useful example of the corner cases that might occur in real-life.

That's my thought too. I've got updates on the OS turned off but I forgot to turn off app updates. Maybe the Netflix App updated while my OS was frozen and that caused my new Netflix issue. I could now update the OS but I fear it could make the problem even worse and mess up Apple tv + again like before. For a period of about 6 months my Apple tv was working flawlessly with Atmos, but now the issue is back.

What I dont understand is how when I did the swap and got a new box, my problem went away! Same OS, same everything. Doesn't make any sense. At that point it did seem to be hardware. Now the problem is back.

I'm going to turn off App updates today and wait to see how things are going with you guys running the latest software.

 

[IraG]

I'm guessing it is largely software, as if it was hardware, the bug would be repeatable and occur on all services.

Now, the question is which software, the OS or the App, or both ?

Having managed software/firmware roll-outs for decades, one can easily have a good App implementation on OS version X, but then issues when OS version Y comes out. Those 'issues' might be A) bugs in the OS, or B) bugs in the App being exposed by the new OS (changes to timing is a common root cause).

It is easy for App vendors and OS vendors to wind up in a bug-loop where for a period, the source and fixes of bugs swap sides. But eventually, everything calms down and works (until the next major release, of course )

Theoretically, the Netflix App might have worked fine on TVOS 14, which allowed up to a 250ms 'gap' in the audio stream from the App before forcing a MAT re-sync at the lower layers, and then TVOS 15 now only allows for a 200ms 'gap' in audio before the re-synch. Again, this conjecture on my part, as it's a useful example of the corner cases that might occur in real-life.

I believe the problem to be a combination of H/W and S/W. I did have the Atmos audio cut out twice on my replacement 2nd gen ATV4k the past two days on Netflix (didn't stream any other services lately). On my launch day 2nd gen ATV4k the Atmos sound typically cut out multiple times per hour, on both ATV+ and Netflix, versus twice over about 20 hours of streaming on the replacement. The replacement ATV4k is still on tvOS 14.7, though I am now questioning the rationale of not upgrading to the latest version.

I never had an issue on my 1st gen ATV4k over several years of use. I assume the 1st and 2nd gen ATV4k streamers run the same software, so my guess is that there is something about the 2nd gen hardware that makes it more sensitive to timing or streaming imperfections, whatever the source. I suspect that could be due to tvOS not being optimized for the 2nd gen hardware. When my audio cuts out completely, it generally doesn't return until after I stop and restart the stream, so it isn't just a matter of resyncing after losing a segment of audio. Losing the audio completely often follows some static or clicking artifacts in the audio. I have also observed the unresponsive volume control, which then catches up with multiple volume steps and overshooting the target, which I believe also suggests poorly optimized tvOS software.

I only bought the ATV4k as it was one of the few (if not only) external streamers that supported the Dolby Vision profile on my Sony XBR-75X940E. The 2nd gen ATV4k was no "upgrade" in my opinion.

 

[Robert D]

I believe the problem to be a combination of H/W and S/W. I did have the Atmos audio cut out twice on my replacement 2nd gen ATV4k the past two days on Netflix (didn't stream any other services lately). On my launch day 2nd gen ATV4k the Atmos sound typically cut out multiple times per hour, on both ATV+ and Netflix, versus twice over about 20 hours of streaming on the replacement. The replacement ATV4k is still on tvOS 14.7, though I am now questioning the rationale of not upgrading to the latest version.

I never had an issue on my 1st gen ATV4k over several years of use. I assume the 1st and 2nd gen ATV4k streamers run the same software, so my guess is that there is something about the 2nd gen hardware that makes it more sensitive to timing or streaming imperfections, whatever the source. I suspect that could be due to tvOS not being optimized for the 2nd gen hardware. When my audio cuts out completely, it generally doesn't return until after I stop and restart the stream, so it isn't just a matter of resyncing after losing a segment of audio. Losing the audio completely often follows some static or clicking artifacts in the audio. I have also observed the unresponsive volume control, which then catches up with multiple volume steps and overshooting the target, which I believe also suggests poorly optimized tvOS software.

I only bought the ATV4k as it was one of the few (if not only) external streamers that supported the Dolby Vision profile on my Sony XBR-75X940E. The 2nd gen ATV4k was no "upgrade" in my opinion.

I am having much the same experience as you. I have noticed though that if I just let it play for long enough that the sound does come back on. I usually end up hitting pause, rewind and then play though because it gets the sound up right away. So next time try letting it play for a bit and see if sound resumes on its own. You end up rewinding it anyhow though because you miss so much dialogue, so thats very annoying.

I too am running on the older OS and am starting to wonder if I should just upgrade to the new one. It sounds like though from reports on here that it might have worse problems than what we are having. Scared to update! Today I just shut off app updates.

I seemed to have the perfect setup there between about May and December because I was having no audio problems at all on any service. Then just last week I found it on Netflix again.

I too have the clicking sounds preceding the audio dropout. I have never had the problem with the volume not responding though. The clicking is what I had happen briefly on For All Mankind on Apple tv+ last week.

What seems insane to me is the fact that doesnt the IOS Apple runs pretty much the same across many of their devices? It seems to be the same operation system as what the phones use and I am assuming Ipod and Ipad too? Does it also run the laptop computers and macs ? I dont see how they can expect to have the same OS run great on so many different kinds of devices.

 

[user 49813]

I believe the problem to be a combination of H/W and S/W

I never had an issue on my 1st gen ATV4k over several years of use. I assume the 1st and 2nd gen ATV4k streamers run the same software, so my guess is that there is something about the 2nd gen hardware that makes it more sensitive to timing or streaming imperfections, whatever the source. I suspect that could be due to tvOS not being optimized for the 2nd gen hardware.

The 2nd gen ATV4k was no "upgrade" in my opinion.

This is where I've pretty much landed also; never had issue with gen1 device either. I guess the question now is, can Apple actually provide a software/OS fix for the issue present in the new H/W? Surprised we haven't seen anything yet. Some of these engineers surely must be using Atmos and HDR/DV at home(?!).

 

[BigGuy]

Given my wife's inability to deal with any technical issues with the surround AV system, the Apple TV would have long been at the curb for trash pickup...and me not far behind! I know, I know...you should see the picture when its working!? Sorry!

 

[Robert D]

This is where I've pretty much landed also; never had issue with gen1 device either. I guess the question now is, can Apple actually provide a software/OS fix for the issue present in the new H/W? Surprised we haven't seen anything yet. Some of these engineers surely must be using Atmos and HDR/DV at home(?!).

I think I mentioned it earlier, there were folks having audio problems with the last gen. I think it was Atmos. I discovered it when searching online for help with our problem. Found it last spring.

 

[IraG]

This is where I've pretty much landed also; never had issue with gen1 device either. I guess the question now is, can Apple actually provide a software/OS fix for the issue present in the new H/W? Surprised we haven't seen anything yet. Some of these engineers surely must be using Atmos and HDR/DV at home(?!).

We are talking about Apple. If they say anything it will likely be that we are listening wrong.

 

[IraG]

I am having much the same experience as you. I have noticed though that if I just let it play for long enough that the sound does come back on. I usually end up hitting pause, rewind and then play though because it gets the sound up right away. So next time try letting it play for a bit and see if sound resumes on its own. You end up rewinding it anyhow though because you miss so much dialogue, so thats very annoying.

I too am running on the older OS and am starting to wonder if I should just upgrade to the new one. It sounds like though from reports on here that it might have worse problems than what we are having. Scared to update! Today I just shut off app updates.

I seemed to have the perfect setup there between about May and December because I was having no audio problems at all on any service. Then just last week I found it on Netflix again.

I too have the clicking sounds preceding the audio dropout. I have never had the problem with the volume not responding though. The clicking is what I had happen briefly on For All Mankind on Apple tv+ last week.

What seems insane to me is the fact that doesnt the IOS Apple runs pretty much the same across many of their devices? It seems to be the same operation system as what the phones use and I am assuming Ipod and Ipad too? Does it also run the laptop computers and macs ? I dont see how they can expect to have the same OS run great on so many different kinds of devices.

The ATV is probably Apple's only device that does Atmos, though. I am curious if the ATV does more than just pass the Atmos bitstream on to the AVR, which I wouldn't have thought takes much processing power.

The reason I bring this up is that at the start of a video stream I often hear audio artifacts for the first few seconds, and that is when the streaming device should be working hard to buffer the video and ramp up the video quality as quickly as possible. It is as if the A12 Bionic in the ATV4k doesn't have enough processing power to do this cleanly. I thought the A12 Bionic was somewhat faster than the A10 Fusion, at least on paper, but if tvOS wasn't optimized for the new H/W, perhaps the gen 2 ATV4k is at a handicap.

 

[Robert D]

The ATV is probably Apple's only device that does Atmos, though. I am curious if the ATV does more than just pass the Atmos bitstream on to the AVR, which I wouldn't have thought takes much processing power.

The reason I bring this up is that at the start of a video stream I often hear audio artifacts for the first few seconds, and that is when the streaming device should be working hard to buffer the video and ramp up the video quality as quickly as possible. It is as if the A12 Bionic in the ATV4k doesn't have enough processing power to do this cleanly. I thought the A12 Bionic was somewhat faster than the A10 Fusion, at least on paper, but if tvOS wasn't optimized for the new H/W, perhaps the gen 2 ATV4k is at a handicap.

Im pretty sure the newer Apple I phones can do Atmos. My Samsung S10 does. We have Apple Music now and the player on that has an Atmos option on my phone and on my daughter's old I phone even. The Atmos setting is found in my phone settings as well. So the Apple TV isnt the only platform. Im pretty sure the processor they use in the Apple TV is the same as they used in the last gen phone. I think the 2 are just one gen apart.

 

[IraG]

Im pretty sure the newer Apple I phones can do Atmos. My Samsung S10 does. We have Apple Music now and the player on that has an Atmos option on my phone and on my daughter's old I phone even. The Atmos setting is found in my phone settings as well. So the Apple TV isnt the only platform. Im pretty sure the processor they use in the Apple TV is the same as they used in the last gen phone. I think the 2 are just one gen apart.

My Note 10+ also has Dolby Atmos, but I don't believe Dolby Atmos or spatial audio with Dolby Atmos for headphones and phones is the same thing as discrete multi-channel audio with Dolby Atmos for home theater use. It seems like overkill for a phone to take a 5.1 audio track and process it to make it sound like it is coming from a real surround sound speaker setup. I have been meaning to try it out on my iPad and Air Pods Pro, though. Fake surround sound has been around for many years, and never was really that impressive to me. I assumed that Dolby Atmos for headphones was just the latest and greatest version, and that the Dolby Atmos name was mostly marketing. But again, I could be wrong.

 

[Robert D]

My Note 10+ also has Dolby Atmos, but I don't believe Dolby Atmos or spatial audio with Dolby Atmos for headphones and phones is the same thing as discrete multi-channel audio with Dolby Atmos for home theater use. It seems like overkill for a phone to take a 5.1 audio track and process it to make it sound like it is coming from a real surround sound speaker setup. I have been meaning to try it out on my iPad and Air Pods Pro, though. Fake surround sound has been around for many years, and never was really that impressive to me. I assumed that Dolby Atmos for headphones was just the latest and greatest version, and that the Dolby Atmos name was mostly marketing. But again, I could be wrong.

Yeah, I'm not sure. I get the impression though that you can use Bluetooth to connect to a TV and watch a movie in streaming, with Atmos. I think it has the discrete channels.

Since the Apple tv is just using a phone processor, it's not a stretch.

 

[IraG]

Yeah, I'm not sure. I get the impression though that you can use Bluetooth to connect to a TV and watch a movie in streaming, with Atmos. I think it has the discrete channels.

Since the Apple tv is just using a phone processor, it's not a stretch.

My point was just that the Atmos in the ATV may not have been as thoroughly developed and tested as other formats. My counterpoint was that I don't see why there should be any Atmos issue if the ATV just passes the bitstream on to the receiver for decoding. Perhaps the receiver plays a larger part in the problem -- my first thought was that it didn't, as the 1st gen ATV4k had no issue in the same setup.

 

[Robert D]

My point was just that the Atmos in the ATV may not have been as thoroughly developed and tested as other formats. My counterpoint was that I don't see why there should be any Atmos issue if the ATV just passes the bitstream on to the receiver for decoding. Perhaps the receiver plays a larger part in the problem -- my first thought was that it didn't, as the 1st gen ATV4k had no issue in the same setup.

None of it makes sense. I agree with what you say. The only thing I differ on is that I read online that some owners did have trouble streaming Atmos movies on the older gen Apple tv 4k. I was surprised to read it. I only recall finding 1 or 2 threads about it. Bumped into it on accident when searching for help with our problem back this spring.

It really seems like for whatever reason, those of us having Atmos problems are a very small minority. The issue appears to get little attention from Apple because of this. When we call in, they tend to blame the problem on others. I called Netflix and they blame Apple.

 

[IraG]

None of it makes sense. I agree with what you say. The only thing I differ on is that I read online that some owners did have trouble streaming Atmos movies on the older gen Apple tv 4k. I was surprised to read it. I only recall finding 1 or 2 threads about it. Bumped into it on accident when searching for help with our problem back this spring.

It really seems like for whatever reason, those of us having Atmos problems are a very small minority. The issue appears to get little attention from Apple because of this. When we call in, they tend to blame the problem on others. I called Netflix and they blame Apple.

The reports I came across on the gen 1 units didn't seem all that consistent or directly related to the issues I was having on my gen 2 unit. I didn't give them much credence as there are so many variables involved, including the possibility of Atmos teething issues, and because I had no issues with my gen 1 ATV4k in the same setup where I was having issues with my gen 2 unit.

I don't know if I would agree that only a minority of ATV4k units have the problem, since the problem occurs in both of our replacement units, though apparently at a much lower frequency. It could be that only the minority of gen 2 ATV4k owners notice the problem or accept that it could be caused be their Apple device, and instead blame it on their ISP or streaming provider, especially since restarting the stream "fixes" the problem.

 

[Robert D]

The reports I came across on the gen 1 units didn't seem all that consistent or directly related to the issues I was having on my gen 2 unit. I didn't give them much credence as there are so many variables involved, including the possibility of Atmos teething issues, and because I had no issues with my gen 1 ATV4k in the same setup where I was having issues with my gen 2 unit.

I don't know if I would agree that only a minority of ATV4k units have the problem, since the problem occurs in both of our replacement units, though apparently at a much lower frequency. It could be that only the minority of gen 2 ATV4k owners notice the problem or accept that it could be caused by their Apple device, and instead blame it on their ISP or streaming provider, especially since restarting the stream "fixes" the problem.

I just know that when I dealt with Apple back in May I was treated like a freak case. Most of the tech people I felt with acted like my problem was a one off. If the problem was that common then they'd be hit with a tsunami of complaints,and would have to do something.

Maybe by now they have more customer complaints, I hope so. I should contact them and do my part. They think my new unit fixed the problem. I just don't want to spend another hour on the phone. So far calling in hasn't helped any.

Has anyone called in recently? How long is the wait and how well do the techs handle the problem? Did you feel like your time was well spent?

 

[IraG]

I just know that when I dealt with Apple back in May I was treated like a freak case. Most of the tech people I felt with acted like my problem was a one off. If the problem was that common then they'd be hit with a tsunami of complaints,and would have to do something.

Maybe by now they have more customer complaints, I hope so. I should contact them and do my part. They think my new unit fixed the problem. I just don't want to spend another hour on the phone. So far calling in hasn't helped any.

Has anyone called in recently? How long is the wait and how well do the techs handle the problem? Did you feel like your time was well spent?

Since both of us had the Atmos issue much more frequently with our original units, I believe there was something different about them, not that it couldn't have been a greater sensitivity to a S/W issue. If most current units exhibit the audio dropouts as infrequently as our replacement units, I expect the problem rarely gets reported, with most people chalking it up to ISP or streaming service issues.

I remain hopeful that a tvOS update will resolve the issue, but I will be surprised if that happens. If the problem gets more frequent than it is now, I can always swap with my gen 1 ATV4k in the family room that nobody is using -- my wife refuses to learn the ATV, Shield, or Tizen apps, sticking with the Roku and Xfinity boxes. My Sony TV in the basement has perfectly good Android TV apps that support DV and Atmos, so there is also that option. In other words, I am not all that motivated to pursue the issue with Apple, as I don't expect a positive outcome.