Pioneer receiver??

I just purchased a pair of ML Purity's and the Encore TF to go along with a Pioneer Elite SC-27 (the update to the SC-07). I'm still waiting for all of them to be delivered but in the meantime I started having some second thoughts on the receiver. I demo'd the Purity with the SC-07 (connected via speaker cable) at a Magnolia and it sounded fantastic (to my novice audophile ears). The Magnolia salesperson said the SC-07 provided a much more balanced sound than the Denon or the Marantz. I was planning on connecting the Purity's via the line out but the Encore would be through speaker cable. My concern is that the Pioneer is only rated for impedance of 6 to 16 ohms but the Encore is 4 ohms. Ideally I would like to use the receiver as I expand/upgrade my system so I want to make sure I start out right. Here are my questions:

1) since I only need the receiver's amp to power the center should I be ok, even at higher volumes?

2) Has anyone had experience with the SC-07 or SC-27 paired with MLs? Any feedback would be great.

3) I've read good things about the Denon AVR 4308ci (or the 4310, although I have heard some criticism about this version) paired with MLs. Would that be a better option? Why? I believe the Denon is also rated 6 to 16 ohms so I would imagine I would face the same issues.

4) What other receivers (sub $2k) would be able to handle a 4 ohm load and come with a competing set of features?

I realize using a receiver is not the optimal option but I have space issues which limit my system. I view the receiver as something to build my system on in the future when I can add the appropriate amps when needed.

Thanks for the help!

PS - I got some great feedback in terms of cables from an earlier post. I am going with Signal ICs and speaker cable.

http://67.19.167.226/~tdacquis/forum/showthread.php?t=9744

Have you considered used or new separates? You could buy a new Emotiva processor for $699 and still have $1300-$1400 left for an amplifier.I would personally recommend a used Sunfire.I think you would like the sound alot better and would not have to upgrade for quite a while.It will not take up much more room than the receiver by itself.Good luck.

Horchem1972 said:

Have you considered used or new separates? You could buy a new Emotiva processor for $699 and still have $1300-$1400 left for an amplifier.I would personally recommend a used Sunfire.I think you would like the sound alot better and would not have to upgrade for quite a while.It will not take up much more room than the receiver by itself.Good luck.

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I think that's pretty sound advice...

(no pun intended)

One important thing to remember is that using speakers wires/ cables with the purity bypasses the purity's internal amplifier (by Martin Logan's design). This can often confuse Mag guys due to a combination of poor training (who cares when Best Buy pays minimum wage) and a similar fully amplified speaker on there floor, the Klipsch icon XF48 which never bypasses the internal class D amp regardless of connection. If you wish to get the best results out of the Purity with a reciver, use top quality interconnects from the Pionner's pre amp outs to the Puritys. The Encore has sparce power requiremnts, so no worries there. The biggest reason to justify seprates is if you have any allusions of upgrading to ESL Logans, which that Pioneer will strugle to push. I would check out the Vista or Vantage, even if there out of your range, just to get an idea of the next step up.

Re-reading your post I realize I skipped a couple of things. One I'll go over quickly, for receivers, I always recommend Yamaha, they tend to have the golden trifecta of acoustics, reliability, and ease of use. Check out the RXZ7 in the SC27 and 4810's price range.

P.S. Go Canes

agente007 said:

1) since I only need the receiver's amp to power the center should I be ok, even at higher volumes?

2) Has anyone had experience with the SC-07 or SC-27 paired with MLs? Any feedback would be great.


I realize using a receiver is not the optimal option but I have space issues which limit my system. I view the receiver as something to build my system on in the future when I can add the appropriate amps when needed.

Thanks for the help!

PS - I got some great feedback in terms of cables from an earlier post. I am going with Signal ICs and speaker cable.

http://67.19.167.226/~tdacquis/forum/showthread.php?t=9744

Click to expand...

Welcome to the club. Your concerns are almost the same as mine. As you may read my previous posts regarding pairing MLs with an AV receiver. I have a SC-07 and Purity for front (before i bought the CLS ), Cinema i center. AV pre-out to Purity line-in and use the receiver to power the center, since the cinema i is hard to drive with sc-07 due to the ESL design and low Sensitivity and impedance), Encore TF center (high Sensitivity 92 db) is different from Cinema's design As low impedance on yours and mine that really not a matter to me. It should not be causing a pairing issue with your SC-27.

In fact, i found out that using the Purity's integrated amp is a perfect mate. Because the build-in amp is designed to pair with the Purity. Thus this would not cause impedance issue. By then your SC-27 should perfectly capable of performing its duty.

Also that when using the receiver's auto MCACC, Room Calibration feature. Each channel is automatically set to its optimal EQ and volume level. I noticed that Cinema i is auto set to +5 db, while others are at -3 db. Thus you can see how hard when using a receiver to drive an ESL.

Bottom line, Use line-in for Purity, not through speaker level. That also will save you from buying speaker cables. A pair of Monster RCA for the Purity is enough to keep you sit in your couch for a while. I dont use Sub, because the Purity is so miracle that really general very low low boom boom.

My advice, stick with your beautiful SC-027, you made a good purchase on your gears as long as you ARE NOT like me to replace the Purity with a CLS, that is really causing a pairing issue with an AV receiver.

ENJOY..

Rvega003 said:

One important thing to remember is that using speakers wires/ cables with the purity bypasses the purity's internal amplifier (by Martin Logan's design). This can often confuse Mag guys due to a combination of poor training (who cares when Best Buy pays minimum wage) and a similar fully amplified speaker on there floor, the Klipsch icon XF48 which never bypasses the internal class D amp regardless of connection. If you wish to get the best results out of the Purity with a reciver, use top quality interconnects from the Pionner's pre amp outs to the Puritys. The Encore has sparce power requiremnts, so no worries there. The biggest reason to justify seprates is if you have any allusions of upgrading to ESL Logans, which that Pioneer will strugle to push. I would check out the Vista or Vantage, even if there out of your range, just to get an idea of the next step up.

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The Mag guy in his defense did explain that he was bypassing the internal amp by using the speaker wire and said it would be preferable to connect through the pre-outs. The reason I brought it up is that I was still impressed with the sound powered by the Pioneer. I ordered interconnects from Signal Cable which should do the trick from what people have said.

Horchem1972 said:

Have you considered used or new separates? You could buy a new Emotiva processor for $699 and still have $1300-$1400 left for an amplifier.I would personally recommend a used Sunfire.I think you would like the sound alot better and would not have to upgrade for quite a while.It will not take up much more room than the receiver by itself.Good luck.

Click to expand...

Interesting thought but I'd like to steer away from separates, at least for now, for three reasons. 1) I have very limited space (small apt in the city) and don't have any room for more than a bare bones system (since I have other source components taking up real estate); 2) I will doubtfully need to upgrade any time soon since my listening area is fairly small and the Vistas/Vantages may be more than I would need; and 3) buying an amp to power just the Encore for right now seems a bit like overkill. One of the reasons I went with the Purity is that it didn't need a separate amp. I'm likely to upgrade at most to a 3.1 system given my space constraints.

I would love to get your thoughts on one idea I had. I could sell the Encore (or possibly keep it stored away for a possible surround speaker in the future) and purchase the Feature as my center. I actually got the Encore for free when I bought the Purity since it was part of the ML promotion. Then I would only need a pre/pro as it would eliminate the need for an amp. I figure this way I have a clean, manageable system that I can expand on later and will be better able to pair an amp to whatever ML speakers I end up buying in the (not so near) future. My question on this setup is, what pre/pro could I buy that is of better quality and feature-packed as the Pioneer for a similar price (keep in mind that I'm getting the Pioneer for less than $1600). I know you recommended the Emotiva but I don't have any experience with it. Is that as good (or better) than the Pioneer?

thanks again for the thoughts.

MLFAN said:

Welcome to the club. Your concerns are almost the same as mine...

ENJOY..

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Thanks! I'm really enjoying reading all the posts here. I'm a beginner so I'm learning a lot. I'm glad to hear you have been satisfied with your setup. That gives me some reassurance that it wasn't just the acoustics in the demo studio! The demo with the Purity/Pioneer pairing blew my socks off if I'm perfectly honest. The Magnolia guy played the Beatle's "Because" and it was like I was listening to music for the first time! He played it on a pair of Vienna's but it just didn't match the clarity I heard from the MLs.

I think for what you are looking for,I would go with the powered center and just keep your Pioneer.I would use the preouts to the front three powered speakers and later on use the receiver to run your rear speakers when you decide to add them.I would use the money you save to buy a very nice sub that is of your liking.Good luck and happy listening.