new CLS ii owner

MLFAN said:

Thank you, I think now i should start to shop for a good amp this summer. Do you think McIntosh is good for those, how about MC275 ?

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MLFan,
I have had a Krell KSA250-KBL, MC275, McIntosh MC252, Sanders amps through my CLS's. I still prefer my McIntosh MC275 and C2200 preamp combo. Once again it all depends on the music you listen to. The MC275 definitely is smooth and refined but lacks some of the detail and punch of a big solid state amp, but of course tubes give you that "breath of Life" in vocals that are hard to attain with solid state.
I still think about a pair of MC501's.... I am afraid to audition a pair with my CLS's..... here I go again... ...
A McIntosh is a good place to start with the CLS's but as mentioned before there are many good amps that work with the CLS, you have to discern what you prefer, but that is the fun part.

MLFAN said:

Craig, Thank you for your great info. What are you using to drive your speakers ? How to tell if one amp has high current output.

I guess from now on, i better off stop pairing my Pioneer SC-07 with the CLS.

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I'm currently using a pair of Electrocompaniet Nemo amps on the CLS. They're powerful beasts running at 600w - 8 ohms and double down to 1200 @4 ohms. At the other extreme I've also used a 16 watt tube amp with excellent results on the CLSIIz's. However, this lowly wattage rated tube is the exception and a special component that is much more capable than it's spec suggests. It is an Art Audio Carissa SET amp using a pair of 845 tubes and sounds wonderful at normal levels but isn't going to blow the roof off the house.

These extremes are a good example of how wattage alone is insufficient in determining the true power of an amp. To make matters worse, tube amps don't seem to list power specs the same way they do for solid state amps. I'm sure it makes sense to those who knowledgeable in the electronics behind all of this but I'm not exactly one of those.

I know the topic of wattage/current has been discussed before but what hasn't? It doesn't hurt to revisit the topic.

Thanks

I truly appreciated what you all take time helping me with such valuable info about my CLS concerns. I now promoted myself from a 1st grader to 5th. I first started to learn more about CLS, next I surely will begin hunting for a right gears to drive them.

I intend to use the CLS for 2-channel music. I am not a Rock nor a Classical fan, Just fall in love listening those Soft with mainly vocal and light instruments, such as, Nora Jones, Michael Buble, Eric Clapton, and Joss Stone...from there you should know my music favorite. Most of time I don't listen in high volume. Because my Mom surely whines and shouts along with the music. ( My Mom lives in my house )

At the moment, I don't think i need to spend too much time just to find a perfect amp to drive the CLS, What i like to do is continuing listen to you guys' recommendations and put all pieces of info into one and take the action. I believe that by the time I take one home, I am still a 5th grader ( not yet to middle school ) and might not be able to tell the difference from one to the others.

Anyone suggests or not recommend that if I use my Pioneer SC-07 pre-out with a Mc275 or Rotel RB1090, At first i want to spend my money with a nice power amp. Or anyone who wants to sell theirs but must live in SF Bay area CA. Thank you all!

:bowdownatrick :bowdown:

I am bacccckkkk

Hi, Guys,

After disappearing for a while from here. I've Been traveling out of country on business trip lately. Recently DIY a little 2 tubes Pre-amp pairing with a used Caver 5 channels power amp ( only 2 channel will be used ) temporary for CD music. ( Still hunting for a better combination: Tube Pre + SS Power-amp )

Just bought a Pionner 05FD blu-ray player. Main purposes are using it for movies and 2 channel CD music ( if it sounds as good as a stand along cd player. My questions:

Is this blu-ray player capable of playing audio CD as good as a stand alone cd player ? such as Marantz cd8003 or Arcom cd17 or cd192..CreekDestiny or Simaudio.

Why an audiophile guys wont consider to use a high end blu-ray player for cd music?

Any one out there can explain ? At least i seldom hearing people saying about this topic.

I am saving up money to spend on a set of a nice gear to drive my CLS, just fall in love with them. At the moment, pairing up with my current gear is really a new experience for music listening. I can't think what it is going to be once the upgrade is done. Hopeful by the end of year.

MLFAN said:

Is this blu-ray player capable of playing audio CD as good as a stand alone cd player ? such as Marantz cd8003 or Arcom cd17 or cd192..CreekDestiny or Simaudio.

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This is very subjective and there is no absolute answer. Some may like your Pioneer some may like the other players better. It all comes down to your tastes and your budget.

Why an audiophile guys wont consider to use a high end blu-ray player for cd music?

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Simple - quality of playback sound and the level of quality one looks for in playback.

Now if you have the Blu-Ray player modded, you can take some significant steps up in sound quality.

Any one out there can explain ? At least i seldom hearing people saying about this topic.

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Explanation - what someone likes better and the cost involved is really what is comes down to.

DTB300 said:

This is very subjective and there is no absolute answer. Some may like your Pioneer some may like the other players better. It all comes down to your tastes and your budget.


Simple - quality of playback sound and the level of quality one looks for in playback.

Now if you have the Blu-Ray player modded, you can take some significant steps up in sound quality.


Explanation - what someone likes better and the cost involved is really what is comes down to.

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Thanks, that's what i wanted to hear the answers from you guys, it's playback sound quality. However, buying a blu-ray or stand alone CD player was not really up to my taste or budget. i was wondering as an audiophile what would he be choosing for CD music if both machines are about the same price range.

i dont really want to use it to play audio CD, but if it is just simply not much difference for playing music in term of sound quality. Is it better off just keep one machine for both purposes.

By the way, how would you suggest me to have it modded in order to improve the sound quality? i am still learning from you guys. Please forgive my dumb questions. thank you.

If you are happy with the sound of your Pioneer, that is all that matters, not what anyone else thinks. It is your rig and your preferences and if you can sit there and tap your toes and enjoy the music, then your setup is perfect. Can you improve on the sound? Possibly but again you need to see what else is out there and listen based on what you want to spend.

Modding a player is getting new parts, or the best mod option is new output stages and/or clocks installed in the player. IMO, VSE (Vacuum State Electronics) and Modwright are the best modders out there. They each offer a different perspective into what they do (modifications) and what players they mod.

Modwright has their own forum at Audio Circles and VSE (Allen Wright - no relations) has a presence in the Hi-Rez forum over at Audio Asylum.

You will also find people who do not like to perform mods and those that do. They are many pros and cons to having a player modded.

More money spent on components does not necessarily equate to better sound and most will probably agree there comes a point of diminsing returns on cost versus improvements. But I would bet a bunch of folks here would agree you can get better music playback than what you are getting with your Pioneer. But again it all depends on what you would consider spending on improvements and would they be worth it to YOU.

Lastly I will also say one of the biggest and newest areas of home audio is room treatment - absorption and diffusion. I have been a fan of room treatments now for over 4 years. Doing treatments will be one of the best performance versus dollar improvements in your sound quality. Two of the main companies out there for home room treatments is GIK Acoustics and Real Traps - both have great products and great customer service.

Remember...enjoying the music is the biggest thing in home audio.

I truly appreciated for your time and patience providing me some basic idea about choosing the right gears. That's really helpful. I am currently using a samsung DVD player for cd music, it seems nothing wrong with playing audio cd. it's soundstage is life and vocal image is so centered. I have never owned a high end stand along cdp. Really have no idea about the differences when using a 4 digits cost cdp verse a cheap low 3 digits cost dvd player. That's why i brought out this topic.

I have been tweaking around my CLS II's placement almost every time when i come home. Lift them up, toe in and vertically move forward/backward million of times until last week I think i found the perfect combination of height and toe-in angle. Thank my wife for giving me a hand. Music comes out from that cheap dvd player ( samsung ) was never been so good. My new pioneer 05FD is still on the way to my home. Once it arrives, i hope its performance wont disappoint me.

MLFAN said:

I truly appreciated for your time and patience providing me some basic idea about choosing the right gears. That's really helpful. I am currently using a samsung DVD player for cd music, it seems nothing wrong with playing audio cd. it's soundstage is life and vocal image is so centered.

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There probably is nothing wrong with it and the sound may be very acceptable to you.

I have never owned a high end stand along cdp. Really have no idea about the differences when using a 4 digits cost cdp verse a cheap low 3 digits cost dvd player. That's why i brought out this topic.

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And you may not want to have any idea of the differences and enjoy what you have. Getting out and hearing some nice sounding equipment may really help empty your wallet :devil: Again it is up to you, but great audio can really get you addicted to great sound and help push you down the path of upgrade-itis.

My new pioneer 05FD is still on the way to my home. Once it arrives, i hope its performance wont disappoint me.

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Nothing like a new piece of gear to come in. I hope you find it to be a good purchase in your pursuit of music enjoyment.

Hi, DBT300,

I have almost forgotten to thank you for your ideas. I do keep watching this forum just to find out what other fans have something in common.

I received my Pioneer 05FD BD players, hooded it up and play a music cd number of times just to see what a BD player would be capable of playing 2ch audio. At the moment i am still moving around my listening area, working hard to correct it into a better listening environment. One thing i can hear the difference though is when watching movie, the sound clarity surely a win compare to my older sony bd player.

I am still tweaking aorund with these babies. Hoping to find out more hints and share with you folks. thank you all.

If you look on the back or side (depending on which model) of the electronics box. It should say CLS or CLS II or CLS IIa and so on. It should be clearly noted. If not send an email to ML and reference the serial # and I would think they can tell you.

stevac said:

Ok, thank you. I found no model, only serial #. Tor

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Hi, First go to the back of both panels, look up to the upper left corner of each panel, you should see a little sticker printed out the panel serial # which will consist of letters and number, first 2 letters should be CS????, WHat can you see ? In the back of electronic boxes, what did you see ? Please completely post them down here, let us to decode the number for you.

PS, If they are just numbers, no letters, most likely they might be the early CLS model. i think ..

if you have no serial on the panels, and no model on the electronics only a serial number then you most likely have early CLS like me. Jim Powers at Martin Logan can confirm or deny, drop him an email.

Value of a Harman Kardon Turntable T65C

Hi, guys

Wish you the best.

Has anyone know what a used HK turntable t65c worths in current market. i could not find a clue online. What year they were made? thx