ML Descent sub vs JL 113 Fathom

I currently have an ML depth sub and will be upgrading sometime to either the descent i or the jl audio 113. Have any members had experience with both these subs?. Do you guys consider one superior over the other?
Thanks in advance

I'm sure that I'm opening myself up for a lot of criticism and there will be some very opinionated views but I prefer the JL all things being equal. The F113 has more output, is more musical and has a smaller foodprint compared to the Descent. That being said I am a ML dealer and a Charter JL Audio dealer. The majority of the subs we sell are JL. The. We F110 is a great sub as well and will likely replace our Depth sales (even though I personally own a Depth that will go along with my newly ordered Spire).
If cost is no object the Gotham is a world class sub of which we have sold several (the last 4 being sold in pairs).
Considering the retail of the Descent being $3k and the F113 being $3800 the Descent just might be a better value. I also think it may have to do with the type of main speaker you own and where you prefer to cross them over at. As a rule we typically cross the mains over at 80hz when using a JL sub as JL recommends. There are just not a whole lot of speakers out there that can play 80hz and down as well as the JL.
With ML subs however I take a different approach and tend to spend more time trying to tune the system and cross the sub over at as low a frequency as possible.

No comparison. JL wins hands down.. I demoed the DepthI and heard the JL f113 and its night and day better.

fathom 113 vs dd18???

I don't mean to Hijack this thread - but what about the Fathom 113 vs Velodyne DD18? Which one would you guys choose?
I am looking for authoritative very low bass that can kick you in the gut if necessary!

My listening room is on the larger side (5000 cubic foot total area) and I am currently (and will be) using my old Velodyne F1800RII sub.

JL FTW again. I would take a Descent over the Velodyne. The DD18 will kick your butt for sure, but it will not sound nearly as musical as either the ML or JL. But those JL beasts are in a league of their own under 80Hz. Its not marketing hype. They deliver what they claim to deliver.

Audiophiliac said:

JL FTW again. I would take a Descent over the Velodyne. The DD18 will kick your butt for sure, but it will not sound nearly as musical as either the ML or JL. But those JL beasts are in a league of their own under 80Hz. Its not marketing hype. They deliver what they claim to deliver.

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what he said... The F113 was originally compared to the DD18 since it was thegold standard a few years ago. Time and time again the F113 was the preferred choice not to mention it is a little smaller and used to be a little cheaper (although the retail has gone up a bit). The ARO that JL uses is pretty incredible for a 1 band EQ and works very well with Audyssey.

These subs are built like tanks too with an unbelievable finishing process.

yes, I guess the technology in the DD18 is a bit behind the times now compared to the JL... Just wondering if that JL with the 13.5 " driver can give you that low, visceral impact that my F1800 is lacking...

update

well I did it! i ordered a brand new JL Fathom 113 and will report back when I have it installed in my HT! Can't wait!:music:

gordonmenninger said:

yes, I guess the technology in the DD18 is a bit behind the times now compared to the JL... Just wondering if that JL with the 13.5 " driver can give you that low, visceral impact that my F1800 is lacking...

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It really believe it can. You have to remember that the JL and other sub manufacturers have improved driver/motor tehnology. I have 2 F113 Fathoms in my room that replaced a REL Stentor III. It's amazing to watch the 13.5" driver move 3.5" and push the amount of air it does.

For those that have experienced JL subs, how are they with a music only situation?

Wonderful. They are a league of their own.

C.A.P said:

Wonderful. They are a league of their own.

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I have to agree with C.A.P.
I am using the F113 with an all Linn 2 channel system and this is the best sub I ever owned or heard anywhere else. It just smokes the competition with its musicality and precision timing.
When plugged into my surround system for movies it provides an almost heart stopping sensation. Friends of mine not used to the physical reactions this sub causes used to start sweating during Star Wars! LOL
As somebody mentioned before: it's built like a tank and I am sure the upgrade to the F113 has been my last sub upgrade for a long, long time.
Give it a try and let us know. You simply have to experience it yourself.

C.A.P said:

Wonderful. They are a league of their own.

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Chris,
How do you think the F113 compares to the Rythmik offerings? I was highly considering them after reading previous discussions. The price is definitely less than the JL. I do love the piano gloss finish of the JL. Top notch!

Got a pair of 110's on the way....

We'll see!

tonepub said:

Got a pair of 110's on the way....

We'll see!

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Keenly interested in your observations on this Jeff, as I've been noodling a pair of 110's for my (2ch music-only) system. F112/F113 seem like overkill for other than HT duty - or do they?

I have 2 JL F113 in my system and they are stunning. One of the best products in high-end audio in my opinion.

RUR said:

Keenly interested in your observations on this Jeff, as I've been noodling a pair of 110's for my (2ch music-only) system. F112/F113 seem like overkill for other than HT duty - or do they?

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Don't know if 112/113's are necessarily overkill, it depends on the quality and tonality of bass response you are after as well as the room.

I was also looking for a solution that wasn't crazy expensive, and a pair of F110's are a bit less than a pair of Descents, also a little bit smaller and that's been a concern in my room as well.

So, we'll see how they shake out!

tonepub said:

So, we'll see how they shake out!

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I'm really interested in how the CLXs merge with subs that don't have Xovers that are specifically tailored for them like the Descent does. It could be a challenging matchup.

RUR said:

Keenly interested in your observations on this Jeff, as I've been noodling a pair of 110's for my (2ch music-only) system. F112/F113 seem like overkill for other than HT duty - or do they?

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Well I guess it depends on your system, the room, music taste and budget but I wouldn't consider the F112 or F113 or even pairs of them to be overkill in pretty much any decent system. In fact I have a customer with a PAIR of Gotham G213 in a 2ch system. Granted, each one is not turned up much at all but the presence of these subs is pretty incredible (both physically and musically).

I would bet that 2 F110 would outperform a single F113 in a 2ch system in most rooms but I am of the dual sub persuasion though.

tonepub said:

Don't know if 112/113's are necessarily overkill, it depends on the quality and tonality of bass response you are after as well as the room.

I was also looking for a solution that wasn't crazy expensive, and a pair of F110's are a bit less than a pair of Descents, also a little bit smaller and that's been a concern in my room as well.

So, we'll see how they shake out!

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I think you will like the F110. We have one on display with the new Anthony Gallo Reference 5LS and it sounds great. I have another one in stock but really don't have enough room to put them both out to demo.