Biwire question...

I looked, and didn't see anyone addressing this issue on these forums (which shocks me, so maybe I just missed it).

My amplifier has two sets of outputs for biwiring, and my speakers have two sets of inputs. Therefore, I expected when I ordered internally biwired cables, they'd have two sets of connectors on both ends. They do not, however. One end of the cable has two connectors, and the other end has four. What do I do with these? And do I need to, or should I get different cables so I can use both sets of connectors on both my amp and speakers?

Depends. If the amp merely shunts the two set of speaker outputs together, then it is probably no advantage and will cost a good bit more. I've been told by quite a few people that there is no advantage to using four separate cables over the standard biwire configuration.

It's a Sunfire TGA 5200, which says if you are biwiring one set of outputs is "voltage source" that should go to the woofer, and the other is "current source" that should go to the tweeter.

Feltran said:

I looked, and didn't see anyone addressing this issue on these forums (which shocks me, so maybe I just missed it).

My amplifier has two sets of outputs for biwiring, and my speakers have two sets of inputs. Therefore, I expected when I ordered internally biwired cables, they'd have two sets of connectors on both ends. They do not, however. One end of the cable has two connectors, and the other end has four. What do I do with these? And do I need to, or should I get different cables so I can use both sets of connectors on both my amp and speakers?

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Feltran -

The cables you have allow you to bi-wire with just a single amp (2 channels). The idea is that the hi and low frequency content is kept separate and it's supposed to sound better. You should be able to bi-wire from either the voltage or current source.

Now if you want to bi-amp with the separate voltage and current source, you'll need another pair of cables (the regular variety). One set of cables runs from the current source and the other from the voltage source.

So really you need 2 pair (four total cables) for the bi-amping.

I don't want to bi-amp, but if I'd get better results from two whole sets of cables, like the amp manual says I can do, it might be worth my time to do that.. The cable's weren't cheap though, so I don't want to buy more if I don't have to ($350 or so, which isn't expensive compared to anything at RMAF, but...).

Feltran said:

I don't want to bi-amp, but if I'd get better results from two whole sets of cables, like the amp manual says I can do, it might be worth my time to do that.. The cable's weren't cheap though, so I don't want to buy more if I don't have to ($350 or so, which isn't expensive compared to anything at RMAF, but...).

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For what it is worth -- I have a sunfire and had them 'double bi-wired' at no extra cost from Sound Advisor (I think??)... Anyway, they were Audioquest bedrock cable.... This gives me 2 cables that are bi-wired - but terminated at both ends (4 spades at each end).... You do this - or get another pair of cables.... but, I think you would have a dangling set of spades at the speaker....

Feltran said:

I don't want to bi-amp, but if I'd get better results from two whole sets of cables, like the amp manual says I can do, it might be worth my time to do that.. The cable's weren't cheap though, so I don't want to buy more if I don't have to ($350 or so, which isn't expensive compared to anything at RMAF, but...).

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Fletran, before you invest in another set of cables, I'd suggest doing a quick test to ensure you will be happy with the effects of running the panels on the current source outputs.

The bass won't be as clean, but the highs are what changes the most (mainly a big dip in the high frequencies).

The 'current outputs' on a Sunfire are basically the same amplifier output as voltage source plus a 1 ohm 20w Resistor.

So don't waste money on 'low resistance' cables for that connection

On the wire for the panels, what you want is low-capacitance.

I've run my panels off of Sunfire Current Source outputs for years, but now that I have better room treatments, I've reverted to current source as the dip at 10Khz (see the documented difference in this post) is a bit much now that the room doesn't ring at high frequencies / high volume.

Also, since we’re talking bi-wire, I generally find it pointless unless one has options like the Sunfire of driving bass module and panel with separate ‘effects’.
But I am a big believer in bi-amping, passive or active.

I think that you'll find from talking to audiophiles is that bi-wiring actually works. Put the discussion of cables, terminations and length philosophy to the side and just try it. I can offer no advice on the Sunfire current/voltage question, but on normal amps bi wiring -- thoughtfully executed -- can be of high sonic benefit.

Enjoy !!

~VDR

I using the Current Source right now because that's what Sunfire recommends for electrostatics. I'll try Voltage Source later.

And do I need to, or should I get different cables so I can use both sets of connectors on both my amp and speakers?

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If you want to take full advantage of the Sunfire you will need different cables.

Here are a few of images to show the difference between biWire and biAmp.

This is (direct)* biWire. In this image 2 total channels are needed, one each for left/right and BOTH outputs (current and voltage) of a given channel are being used.


This is ACTIVE biAmp. In this image 4 total channels are needed, two each for left/right and only ONE output (current or voltage) of a given channel is being used.


You can also do a PASSIVE biAmp which is similar to ACTIVE (4 total channels) but no external XO is used and the passive crossover is still in place. You just need to jumper the input channels together which is made easy on the Sunfire.


It is important to make sure the terminal jumpers on the speakers are removed ESPECIALLY if biAmping.

The stages of sonic improvement are:
1. Internal biWire (using the cables you now have).
2. (Direct)* biWire (first image)
3. Passive biAmp (third image)
4. True biAmp (second image)

*(direct) my distinction