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VanDaRo

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I am considering reorganizing my system such that each amp resides next to the speaker that it drives. This will allow me to use significantly shorter runs of speaker cable, but longer runs of IC. I am told that this is the preferred layout by the golden ear types. So --

1) Is this a correct philosophy ?

2) Where might I order 2 pairs of 10' IC cable that sounds good, but doesn't cost a mint ?

Thanks !!

~VDR
 
I am considering reorganizing my system such that each amp resides next to the speaker that it drives. This will allow me to use significantly shorter runs of speaker cable, but longer runs of IC. I am told that this is the preferred layout by the golden ear types. So --

1) Is this a correct philosophy ?
There are proponents of both schemes. There was a reviewer in TAS who once said that any speaker cables less than 8' do not sound right to him. Take it for what it's worth - another opinion.

Of course, with longer runs of IC you are better off running balanced, though 10' is not very long.
 
There was a reviewer in TAS who once said that any speaker cables less than 8' do not sound right to him. Take it for what it's worth - another opinion.
I have never tested this but I also have thought this to be somewhat true. My system sounded better at times with longer runs. May be its the Impedance or something in that longer run. I will be testing it out soon as I am gonna try some short runs from my amp ! Same type speaker cable too. !
 
I have never tested this but I also have thought this to be somewhat true. My system sounded better at times with longer runs. May be its the Impedance or something in that longer run. I will be testing it out soon as I am gonna try some short runs from my amp ! Same type speaker cable too. !
Please report your findings here. Better still, start a new thread with an appropriate title. I am really interested in what you discover.
 
There are proponents of both schemes. There was a reviewer in TAS who once said that any speaker cables less than 8' do not sound right to him. Take it for what it's worth - another opinion.

Of course, with longer runs of IC you are better off running balanced, though 10' is not very long.

FWIW, Pierre Sprey of Mapleshade also ascribes to this philosophy.

GG
 
If you run longer normal ICs, you have a better chance of picking up stray electrical interference due to the inherently low level of the ICs' signals. This noise would then be amplified by the downstream amps.

Balanced IC connections are a special case, considerably less susceptible to this because they inherently have what's referred to as common mode rejection. The actual signal is represented by the difference in levels between the + and - paths, but an induced noise spike raises both sides equally, not affecting the difference, aka the signal. (Note, this is in an ideal circuit; typical rejection is expressed as a ratio, often 1000:1 or higher, so for our purposes, the noise is inaudible).

Longer runs of speaker cable are operating at a very high level compared to typical electrical interference, so the noise picked up is effectively inaudible (assuming you don't do something stupid like run your speaker cables parallel to a house wiring circuit or similar).
 
If you want to stay with conventional (RCA) type cables, I've had great luck with Audioquest. I think they're an awesome sounding cable and not super expensive. I use them between my amp & preamp, and from my CD player.
HTH!
 
I'm thinking about going with ICs from Blue Jeans, model LC-1. The run to each amp will be ~12' since I will put my equipment rack in the corner of the room. The price is right on these cables, they are shielded and come with a abrasion resistant jacket. This will keep the cost of the experiment very reasonable.

Other line-level ICs will remain Siltech 80 stranders with WBTs. Speaker cables are yet to be determined, but I'm considering halving and re-terminating a 10' pair of Tara Labs RSC (stiff as a mutha...). I'll need to order a mess of banana jacks to do this since the speakers are bi-wired. BJ cables has decent stuff available in this regard too.

I know that the BJ stuff is not as flashy as the high-dollar cables, but many people have given them high marks.

Opinions ??

~VDR

ps... a review of the result would undoubted result from this for all those interested.
 
I've been using the Blue Jeans interconnects for quite some time, and am quite pleased with them... no bling, they just sing!
 
Blue Jeans Cables are very good. I was using some of their balanced cables in my system for a while. I still think Signal Cable is better and recommend you consider them. I particularly like their Silver Resolution series, which is what replaced the Blue Jeans balanced interconnects (6' length) in my system. For the length you are going, you would probably want to consider their Analog Two Balanced Interconnects to save some money. They would set you back about $100 a pair for that length.
 
What I really like about this forum, other than it being full of ESL nuts, is that we all have very well founded opinions that are also well (and sometimes aggressively) argued.

~And for that, I cannot thank you all enough ~ :bowdown:

I checked out the Signal Cable site, and it would appear that they offer a nice product that would certainly be within my target price..... Remember, this is an experiment for me. Success is purely dependent upon my listening "sensations". The real effort here is to make the listening room a little more "Wife Acceptable".... That being said, I am likely to fail no matter what I do. Oh well !!

Thanks again fellas, and keep the opinions coming !! :rocker:

~VDR
 
The Signal Cables are looking better by the minute... Time to take a break from DiMeola and McCartney for a phone call....

~VDR

5 minute later update: Sales guy is on vacation. He'll hear from me tomorrow.
 
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5 minute later update: Sales guy is on vacation. He'll hear from me tomorrow.

That's not just the sales guy. That's Frank, and he is Signal Cable. If you call and leave him a message or email him with your phone number, he will most likely call you back as soon as he gets a chance.
 
I still think Signal Cable is better and recommend you consider them. I particularly like their Silver Resolution series
Rich, I have heard many times the claim that silver cables are bright, but you obviously do not think so as you use them.

I have some limited experience with silver cables. I used them to rewire a tonearm that went defective many years ago, and really hated the sound as it was too bright.

Comments ?
 
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I use the Signal Cable Silver Resolution Digital Coax for my DVD Player and have liked it the best for cost versus sound when choosing Coax cables. I had always liked the Straightwire Info Link Coax, but sold it with my DAC, so I cannot compare to that. But compared to all other coax cables I have tried (many), the Signal has been by far the best. The only downside is I am not a Bullet connector fan.

I have not checked out the Signal IC's to comment on for audio.

In regards to all silver IC's, the DH Labs Revelation to date is the best sounding pure silver IC I have heard, but it is fairly high priced.

I use Zu Cables for all my audio setup (2ch and MCH) and have found them to sound the best in my setup and for my tastes.

In regards to your question, my IC and speaker cable length is dictated by the room I have available and where my equipment can reside. I have longer speaker cables, than my IC's. If you can get trials of each in different lengths, then you can decide which sounds better to you for the cost involved.
 
Rich, I have heard many times the claim that silver cables are bright, but you obviously do not think so as you use them.

I have some limited experience with silver cables. I used them to rewire a tonearm that went defective many years ago, and really heated the sound as it was too bright.

Comments ?

I have heard this too, Bernard, and was a little unsure about trying them at first. But I guess it just depends on the synergy with the other components in your system. I find them to be incredibly neutral and revealing. No brightness issues at all.

Perhaps those who attributed the brightness to their silver cables were actually experiencing brightness from a component which was masked when using copper cables. Or perhaps their room was too bright and the silver cables exacerbated that effect. I don't know. All I know is they work great for me with the Marantz SA11S1, the ARC Ref 3 and the Sanders Amps feeding my Summits in a well-treated room. I get highly detailed and rich, but very neutral balanced sound (not too warm, not sterile, and not bright -- just full, clear, and rich).

One other thing to note: the Signal Cable Silver Resolution speaker cables (which I am using) are a hybrid design, with four stranded silver conductors combined with eight solid-core copper conductors. Perhaps this is how they manage to get the resolution benefits of the silver without the harshness that silver is known for.
 
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VDR,

I'd go with short interconnects / long speaker cables, unless I had a real good reason why I wanted long interconnects. Really good reasons include, for instance, component placement constraints.

I could also build a case for long interconnects if the intention was to use them as tonal filters to mask another system or room deficiency e.g. harshness/brightness. Long interconnects are more efficient filters than short interconnects.

But I'd rather solve the real problem than fight the symptom with a band aid. Consider:

The interconnects between pre- and power amps are the most sensitive connection in the entire system. It is here that signals have the lowest level. Therefore any kind of noise that gets through here is most detrimental, because it too will be amplified.

Conversely, the connections between amps and speakers are high power. A noise level which is huge compared to the interconnect signal level will be insubstantial compared to the signal level on a speaker cable.

The argument that short speaker cables have a lower resistance doesn't hold water. My cables are nothing special, however their DC resistance is only about 1 Ohm per kilometer! (Capacitance is low as well.) In other words the difference between a 1 m cable and a 4 m cable is only 3 mOhm. Yeah, that's substantial. Not!

(Note: those are SI units. I am back in Europe now. Meaning that I no longer measure speed in furlongs per fortnight - or lengths in feet. I still appreciate a pint, though. :D)
 
Notes on BJC vs Signal Cable vs Zebra Cables

Since two out of three have been discussed in this thread:

Signal Cable is one of my favorite cable vendors. I have an Analog Two as well as a Silver Resolution IC (and several power cords). These are good cables with excellent build quality and looks.

Zebra Cables is another high-end low-cost cable manufacturer. I have have a number of their ICs and a pair of speaker cables also (plus several power cords). Similar specs and good build quality. Similar prices.

Unlike Signal Cable Zebra Cables have a true online ordering system. Zebra also have locking RCA connectors. Signal, OTOH, offers Eichmann Bullets as well as silver cables. Choosing between them is a matter of preference; I'd call them equivalent in terms of physics or purse. Both need at least two weeks from order to delivery.

As far as Blue Jeans Cables, I have 10 White and 12 White speaker cables which I terminated with their superb and cheap locking (not looking!) banana plugs. The resulting cables do look plain. However, since I made them I have learned more about TechFlex, heat shrink, splitters and so forth, so I could dress them up. I have absolutely no complaints about sonics.

BJC ICs work well but I find them ugly compared to Signal and Zebra etc. I am also not fond of their celebrated Canare plug. It is too long and inflexible, and I feel that the Eichman, Signal, Zebra plugs make a better connection, too.

BJC shipping was fast while I was living in the US. It is good to know that BJC have a UK web shop as well. When I need more locking bananas or round speaker cables I'll order them there.
 
I'm also a user of Signal Cables. When I re-arranged my system I needed 28ft runs from pre to amp. I ended up buying Analog 2 XLRs as they were within my limited price range. The unfortunate part is that I was never able to AB test with my previous cables due to the system overhaul. I'm happy with the sound and I've never looked back.
 

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