Vista vs Vantage?

Hey, there's a dearth of reviews of the Vistas out there so I figured I'd post here. Vistas vs Vantages, input? I'm primarily concerned with the stat panel. According to ML they are about the same size, is that correct? I have 3 subs in my setup, so I'm not worried about bass output, but my current Apogee's are a little harsh on female vocals so I'm thinking about getting back into the Logan fold.

James

Good morning James,
I started out wanting to buy Vistas, and posted that in the ML club classifieds. I then got an email from a club member that was selling a pair of 6 month old Vantages for a tad more than I could get Vistas. I am very happy with them. I now have 4 subs in my livingroom.
I think the Vantages are incredible.

Lee

James,

I have the Vista's and I use an SVS PC-Ultra Subwoofer with them. I love the speakers. Having said that, I haven't spent much time listening to the Vantages so I am not in a good position to give a direct comparison. Dick Oshler in the Absolute Sound said he found the Vista's "thin" in the upper bass (200-400Hz) and in his opinion a subwoofer would not correct for that deficiency.

I personally don't find that to be a problem with my setup, but I went to the Vista's from Aerius i's and so I am well indoctrinated to the Martin Logan sound. I am still playing CD's that I haven't listened to with the Vista's yet, and every time I do it is an amazing experience. Just a couple of days ago, I put on Steely Dan's Two Against Nature and on Jamie Runaway, I swear the electric piano was coming from the sides of me, and even though I knew it was a stereo CD, I involuntarily looked at my surround amp to make sure that it was still turned off.

I think most of the opinions here are if you have the money, the Vantage is a better speaker becuase it is a bit stronger in the bass (meaning mid to upper bass) than the Vista. I don't think you will find much of a difference if any at all in the midrange and treble of the two speakers. The panels are virtually the same.

I feel there is a reason why Martin Logan makes the Vantage, and why it cost more than the Vista. It must sound better, and from brief listening at a dealer, I think it does. For me I got a good deal on my Vista's and they sounded close enough to the Vantage I couldn't justify spending the extra money.

In the end you will have to make that same cost benifit decision and you are the only one who can make that decision.

Regards,

Chuck

cstory, how do the Vistas compare to the Aerius'? I've had Aerius', SL3's, and ReQuests, and CLS's....

cstory said:

I swear the electric piano was coming from the sides of me, and even though I knew it was a stereo CD, I involuntarily looked at my surround amp to make sure that it was still turned off.


Regards,

Chuck

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Very cool Chuck! :music:

The difference between the two begins with......

1) Vantages are are made completely in Lawrence, Ks whereas the Vista is assembled in Lawrence. They share the same ESL panel(made here) but he Vista's bass enclosure is produced in Asia.

2) Vista has a non-powered bass driver, Vantage is powered

3) Vantage cross-over is hand wired made in M/L's Lawrence factory, Vista cross-over is on printed circuit board again made in Asia

4) Vantage crosses over @ 400hz, Vista @450hz

The sum of the above is what provides the different 'sonic signature'.

Here's some of my own thoughts on the Vista. I like them, so I'm biased.

They need more break-in than any speaker I've owned, purchased or built. The first hundred hours gets the panel sounding nice, but the bass driver needed a few hundred until they really began to come to life. Don't be afraid to give them a workout - you'll be rewarded.

The Vista sounds really poor without spikes. I've always been a proponent of spikes on loudspeakers, but used the metal disc 'feet' during the break-in period while selecting the ideal location and toe-in. Simply installing the spikes was an incredible change, to the degree that I don't believe it's fair to judge this speaker without them.

My Vistas replaced a pair of SL3s. I've auditioned the Vantages and heard a pair at a acquaintance's house, and always thought they did some really magical things with vocals, and hoped to own a pair eventually. I happened across a 'too-good-to-pass-up' deal locally for a new pair of Vistas, so I jumped at the chance knowing I could always sell them used for a small profit and keep saving my pennies for Vantages. I really had my doubts when first hooking them up, as they just didn't have the dynamic punch of the SL3, but after a solid few hundred hours, I'm confident it was the right decision. To my ear, and without being able to do a side-by-side comparison, they sound like the Vantages in nearly every respect, but they don't go as low. Mine are in a moderately sized living room (12' x 28' x 8'), powered by an Outlaw 7500 (200wpc), and save for a -3dB that leaves some of that bottom octave to the imagination, they really kick butt.

FYI - I've always been the breed of audiophile who would sacrifice the bottom octave for some magic in the mids and highs. The ProAc Response 2 was one of my favorite speakers, and most of the DIY speakers I've built have been in a similar vain. The Vista actually has a good deal of bass kick, and with some help from a subwoofer, they're exactly what I was wishing for. Currently I run them with a Descent crossed over at 40Hz, 3/10 level, +3dB EQ.

- Jason

jjcarr said:

cstory, how do the Vistas compare to the Aerius'? I've had Aerius', SL3's, and ReQuests, and CLS's....

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I would compare the Vista's to the Aerius by saying that the Vista's are everything the Aerius is, but more. More dynamic, more detailed, more neutral, better imaging, etc. The only thing the Aerius seems to have more of is bass, but I suspect that is because the bass on the Vista is better integrated to the panel. The Aerius was a great speaker, and the Vista represents a couple of generations of refinement. They are obiously both from the same gene pool with the Vista improving on all those things that were good about the Aerius and making them better.

I was happy with my Aerius', but our system does double duty in home theater, and I felt that perhaps they were straining a bit to keep up with the loud bits of movies. The Vista's can play a bit louder without strain so they do better with movies. As a bonus, I find myself listening to more music with the Vista's. It is actually spooky how with stereo recordings the center image of a singer or an instrument is so focused that it seems like it is coming from the center channel even though the center channel is off. The Aerius never quite pulled that trick off.

Chuck

cstory said:

I would compare the Vista's to the Aerius by saying that the Vista's are everything the Aerius is, but more. More dynamic, more detailed, more neutral, better imaging, etc. The only thing the Aerius seems to have more of is bass, but I suspect that is because the bass on the Vista is better integrated to the panel. The Aerius was a great speaker, and the Vista represents a couple of generations of refinement. They are obiously both from the same gene pool with the Vista improving on all those things that were good about the Aerius and making them better.

I was happy with my Aerius', but our system does double duty in home theater, and I felt that perhaps they were straining a bit to keep up with the loud bits of movies. The Vista's can play a bit louder without strain so they do better with movies. As a bonus, I find myself listening to more music with the Vista's. It is actually spooky how with stereo recordings the center image of a singer or an instrument is so focused that it seems like it is coming from the center channel even though the center channel is off. The Aerius never quite pulled that trick off.
Chuck

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Interesting observation. I believe I have that focus with my Aerius, though I think it has to do with the room and positioning, even more so than with the speaker itself.

slowGEEZR said:

Interesting observation. I believe I have that focus with my Aerius, though I think it has to do with the room and positioning, even more so than with the speaker itself.

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I agree. I think room acoustics plays a much larger role in this than which ML speaker you are using. I have achieved this kind of imaging with both my Ascents and my Summits, but it was highly dependent on placement and room acoustics.