Auditioned CJ's ~ LP-140 Mono-Blocks and then a Pair of ~ VTL 450 Tubed Mono-Blocks..

My audition of the conrad-johnson LP-140 mono-blocks occurred at a high-end audio store in Berkeley, CA. The listening room was approximately 22’ x 15’, and was appropriately sonically treated diffusers and absorption tubular traps in all corners and walls. The listening room was carpeted. I was seated in a standard chair in the sweet spot.

The equipment in used for this audition:

Speakers………………. ~ Wilson Sophia’s
Source…………………. ~ Ayre Audio’s C5 CD/SACD player.
Preamp………………… ~ conrad-johnson CT-6
Speaker / IC Cables…… ~ Synergistic Reseach Ref.
Amplifiers……………. ..~ Two conrad-johnson LP-140 mono-blocks (review).

First, I need to say these conrad-johnson tubed mono-blocks are huge, about 130 lbs. each, quite impressively, if I do say so myself. They were set-up in the center of the room on Grand-Prix single amp stands about six inches off the floor. Those Grand-Prix amp. stands looked very cool. All of the other electronic gear was mounted on Composite Products ~ three (clear ½ inch plexi- glass) shelves rack, which was awesome.

I brought my own CD’s and SACD’s of course, I asked the sales rep. to begin with Chris Thile’s ~ Not All Who Wander Are Lost (SACD). Spacifically track #7 called, “Club G.R.O.S.S.”. This track is superb for just Mandolin and Sax (no vocals). I had auditioned this same song with the McIntosh MC275’s about 8 – 10 months ago. The sales rep. happily complied, adding he’d never heard Chris Thile before. From the opening notes of music the music came forward and immediately positioned the two performers in the room. They were their right their with me in the listening room – the Mandolin and the alto Sax in all their full-on glorious splendor. The bass was there but the mid-range and highs were so smooth and sweet. The clearness and beautiful timber of these instruments were excellent. The sonic imagining of each note was wonderfully very easy on my ears. I could listen all day to this kind of beautiful music.

I realized almost immediately that the speakers were in no-way my lovely Ascent i - electrostatic speakers… The Wilson – Sophia’s were in no-way as sweet and beautiful on the mid range or highs as my Ascent i’s. In addition, the bass speakers of the three-way Sophia’s was not even comparable to my Descent subwoofer but one does what one must allow for these kind of things when auditioning amplifiers in store…

I was able to distinguish the simply marvelous nature of the Ayre C5 ~ CD/SACD source player. This player is simply a wonderful sounding player. It must have been influencing the details of the music to a stellar degree. It was especially lovely and detailed in delivery for the SACD’s and the one Redbook CD I brought for audition. I now have moved-up the Ayre C5, on my list to the number two spot just behind the Marantz SA-7S1 CD/SACD player. The Arye C5 was quick accurate and most importantly beautiful to listen to.

Back to the main reason I was auditioning in the store, the CJ ~ LP-140 mono-blocks. I was listening hard to see if these beauties rounded off the highs at all. I was looking to see just how the CJ ~ LP-140 mono-blocks handled the next CD Eva Cassidy’s – Live at Blues Alley specifically the song “Wonderful World”. In addition to the first five tracks of Pink Floyd’s – Dark Side Of The Moon SACD. I am very happy to report, I was not disappointed at all… The answer was the highs were absolutely not rolled off, they were clear and their was a thereness to the women’s voices not harsh or shrill but lovely and purely positioned in the air just in front of the amplifiers themselves. These amplifiers did gave a presence to the music. The Rockn’ Roll songs of Pink Floyd were as I had never heard them before as far as sweet clearness of presentation.

Adjusting the volume of the LP-140’s sounded just lovely at all reasonable loudness levels for the audition. I listened for over an hour. Conrad-johnson LP-140 mono-blocks are convincingly lovely.

So, I thought I had finished my audition….

I looked up sweetly at my sales rep. batted my baby blues and sheepishly asked if I could audition the newest VTL 450, tubed mono-blocks. I knew the owner of the VTL company had just delivered these beauties to the store, personally, the day before from Chico, CA. The VTL 450 mono-blocks were set-up in a different listening room of the store. My sales rep. said, without hesitation, yes we can do that…. And with that this wonderful store flew into action. Two other big strong guys came in, unplugged the CJ LP-140 mono-blocks and whisked them out of the room, one by one. I protested saying, ‘I would be glad to go into the next room and listen to the VTL’s’. My sales rep. quickly said, ‘Oh no…, you need to compare the VTL’s with the very same electronic gear and listening room, which I had listened to the CJ ~ LP-140 mono-blocks’. Sooooo, I sat back down and these wonderful gentlemen brought in the stunningly beautiful, VTL 450 mono-blocks… 300 watts into 8 ohms each, they are the new, self-biasing, electronic tube designed mono-blocks, weighing in at upwards of 140 lbs. each. New, they cost about $500.00 (USD) more than the CJ ~ LP140 mono-block pair, which were a cool $13K (New), so $13.5K for the VTL 450 mono-blocks…

I listened to the exact CD and SACD’s I had listened to before with the CJ ~ LP-140 mono-blocks. From the very beginning notes I heard the differences. The VTL 450 mono-blocks were presenting the music closer to the center of the room. It was like the musicians had all moved up a foot or two. The bass notes were deeper and had more resonance, timber. Each note popped with a more authoritativeness and much more clear and with a smoother cleanness than the CJ LP-140’s. These amplifiers did what the CJ’s had just done with the music during my previous audition only these VTL 450 mono-blocks were presenting the music in a next step-up. The tube sweetness was there, yes… The timber and imagining was there, yes… The VTL 450’s were delivering the same high quality sound as the CJ ~ LP-140’s only with more tubed timber, definition sweetness and authority.

I was so blown-away… Then something unusual happened…. I started to cry when hearing Eva Cassidy’s, Wonderful World being played again through these lovely VTL 450 tubed mono-blocks… I remembered the last time I had been brought to tears by lovely sweet music; it was when I had auditioned the McIntosh MC275’s audition about 8 – 10 months ago. I started thinking..., was I hearing the same sound? Were these VTL 450’s producing the quality I had heard before? I though… I listened some more… And I concluded..., Yes!!! This was the same sound I had heard the MC275 making on the same Eva Cassidy song, which I had brought to that audition as well. I decided, well, I'll listen to Pink Floyd next to decide for sure. And as the captivatingly exquisite “Dark Side Of The Moon” played and the first five tracks came forth, I knew the VTL 450’s were producing a very similar not exact match to the McIntosh MC275’s probably a little better but not by much. They were very, very close though, the sound of the VTL’s and the Mac's. Just lovely...

All in all I think the audition went extremely well. It took most of a Saturday, what with the long drive from Calistoga. I shook everyone’s hand and thanked everyone two and three times for the wonderful audition. The only think my sales rep. said which showed his audio naiveté was he thought I should go for the Wilson – Sophia’s instead of those electrostatic speakers… He said, “What did you call them?” I said, ‘Martin Logan – Summits.” I had told him, before that I was only interested in ML Summits for speakers. He didn’t know what I meant, somehow I don’t think he ever will…

A very intersting session you had there, Robin! One caution - some tube amps do not react to electrostatics very well. Low impedance may cause some of them problems. It's too bad you could not have auditioned those on some sort of electrostatic panel. The truth of the matter is that with so few high-end stores around, it's very difficult to find one that has equipment around that is similar to your's.

It sounds like you had a great time and you described what you heard in a most eloquent way. As I read your review I was almost able to hear what you were describing. It is also clear which set of amps you preferred, at least on the Wilsons. Great job!

Sounds like you had a wonderful audition, Robin. I knew you would appreciate the sound of the CJ gear. The LP 140 monoblocs produce a really sweet midrange and top end. But I'm not surprised you preferred the sound of the VTL. I have always been a proponent of headroom in an amp. A higher wattage amp is simply able to reproduce dynamic transients more accurately, providing more definition and authority to the music.

Of course, you must understand that the things you learned are somewhat colored by the equipment you auditioned them with. By that I mean that these amps will act differently powering the Summits than they did powering the Wilsons. The CJ LP 140 will sound even sweeter and more effortless with the Summits because it is relieved of woofer duty. It is possible that the CJ would sound even better than the VTL on the Summit.

The important thing is that you have listened to three different top brands of tube amplifiers and have begun to get a good feel for the sound that a quality tube amplifier can bring to your system. If you purchase the Summits (or similar) down the road, and you purchase a quality tube amp and preamp from any of the top manufacturers (CJ, BAT, Cary, ARC, Macintosh, Manley, VTL, VAC, etc. etc.) you will have a system that will continually blow your mind and make you cry every time you put on Eva Cassidy. Then you will have reached true audio nirvana and probably be cured of joeyitis forever.

ML's Would Have Been Great!

aliveatfive said:

A very intersting session you had there, Robin! One caution - some tube amps do not react to electrostatics very well. Low impedance may cause some of them problems. It's too bad you could not have auditioned those on some sort of electrostatic panel. The truth of the matter is that with so few high-end stores around, it's very difficult to find one that has equipment around that is similar to your's.

Click to expand...

aliveatfive,

Yes. I agree, electrostatics, especially ML's would have been wonderful to audition with this amazing high-end gear. Unfortunately, I am forced to use my memory of the ML sound as to how these tubed amps and associated gear might sound with ML's... Oh well, I got some idea anyway. I just wish I had more time to audition more often...

The Impact Beautiful Tubed Sounds Caused in Me...

tonyc said:

It sounds like you had a great time and you described what you heard in a most eloquent way. As I read your review I was almost able to hear what you were describing. It is also clear which set of amps you preferred, at least on the Wilsons. Great job!

Click to expand...

tonyc,

Personally, for me..., I seem to react physiologically to disarmingly sweet tubed sounds. Naturally, it depends so much on the song... It has to be a moving tune as well. I think that's why I always choose Eva Cassidy's "Wonderful World". If the sweetness is there - I'll be crying...
The purity of the lovely musical notes seems to go directly to my heart and I react by becoming emotional (crying). I guess, it is proving to be a good indicator of the highest level of tubed sound quality, which impacts me on a gut level...

If word gets out, folks we'll start wanting me to audition their gear before they buy, just to make doubly sure they are spending large sums on the most emotionally exciting tubed gear possible...

I do trust my ears and my heart as well...

Auditioning Tubed Gear...

Rich said:

Sounds like you had a wonderful audition, Robin. I knew you would appreciate the sound of the CJ gear. The LP 140 monoblocs produce a really sweet midrange and top end. But I'm not surprised you preferred the sound of the VTL. I have always been a proponent of headroom in an amp. A higher wattage amp is simply able to reproduce dynamic transients more accurately, providing more definition and authority to the music.

Of course, you must understand that the things you learned are somewhat colored by the equipment you auditioned them with. By that I mean that these amps will act differently powering the Summits than they did powering the Wilsons. The CJ LP 140 will sound even sweeter and more effortless with the Summits because it is relieved of woofer duty. It is possible that the CJ would sound even better than the VTL on the Summit.

The important thing is that you have listened to three different top brands of tube amplifiers and have begun to get a good feel for the sound that a quality tube amplifier can bring to your system. If you purchase the Summits (or similar) down the road, and you purchase a quality tube amp and preamp from any of the top manufacturers (CJ, BAT, Cary, ARC, Macintosh, Manley, VTL, VAC, etc. etc.) you will have a system that will continually blow your mind and make you cry every time you put on Eva Cassidy. Then you will have reached true audio nirvana and probably be cured of joeyitis forever.

Click to expand...

Rich,

Excellent points Rich. Yes, the sales rep. also mentioned this to me. The power out put is something to factor in. A huge concideration is the quality of the various preamp used as well. The CJ CT-6 deserves a lot of the credit supplying the control influence to the system I was listing to. :cheers:

This audition was a lot of fun. I felt a bit guilty listening for hours and then just leaving without buying anything. But as the sales rep. said that's what they do, it didn't bother them so it no longer bothers me. I did have a good time being catered to and fonded over, in an audio kind of way...

I think, I'll do more auditioning in the future and bring some tissues next time.

Robin said:

tonyc,

Personally, for me..., I seem to react physiologically to disarmingly sweet tubed sounds. Naturally, it depends so much on the song... It has to be a moving tune as well. I think that's why I always choose Eva Cassidy's "Wonderful World". If the sweetness is there - I'll be crying...
The purity of the lovely musical notes seems to go directly to my heart and I react by becoming emotional (crying). I guess, it is proving to be a good indicator of the highest level of tubed sound quality, which impacts me on a gut level...

If word gets out, folks we'll start wanting me to audition their gear before they buy, just to make doubly sure they are spending large sums on the most emotionally exciting tubed gear possible...


I do trust my ears and my heart as well...

Click to expand...

Robin, it is so interesting that you mention that particular song and it's effect on you, and how it is such an integral component not only of your auditioning of new equipment, but of your reaction to music in general.

At the highest level this of course is the function of art, to touch the observer (or in this case listener) in such a way that they become engaged and participate in the event. Your emotional reaction is indeed what this hobby, in the best of situations, should evoke in all of us. It doesn't happen all the time, but when it does, that "goosebump" factor is what really distinguishes High End audio from the middle ground in my mind. It is truely transcendant.

What is especially touching to me about your descriptions here is that it harkens back to an experience I'd had at the Rocky Mountain Audio Fest last fall. I was listening to the rather amazing Escalante loudspeakers, with THAT SONG from THAT album. The electronics were all Pass, which had me excited to listen to the system based upon some things I'd read about both the speakers and the electronics. I have to tell you that the magic simply wasn't there. It sounded good, but I'd expected it to sound great, so I was very disappointed. The next day I was in yet another room and they were driving the exact same Escalante speakers with the Butler Monad amplifier. We put on THAT SONG again from THAT ALBUM, and the difference was beyond belief. The music was THERE, the magic was THERE. People were coming in from the hallways, beconed in as it were from the amazing sounds emminating from within. It was amazing. I wept, and so did others. It was a magical moment.

Beyond the music, it was also a powerfull reminder of exactly what aliveatfive is telling you. sometimes equipment has a specific synergy, sometimes it doesn't. You will never really know exactly how well either the CJ equipment or the VTL equipment will react with your speakers in your room until you have the opportunity to experience that exact combination.

For your sake I hope you do.

Realizing My Dream...

Tim,

Thank you. Yes, I hope I can not only experience that certin combination of just the right audio equipment to produce that special sound I heard during my recent audition but to actually own the audio equipment. That would be my dream. It is a sound which I could never tire of hearing, inpoint of fact, it is the sound I have been searching for... That certin combination of audio components which can make a great singer, like Eva Cassidy singing Wonderful World make me weep with out even trying. That is the sound and audio equipment I have been longing for...

I realize that now. It is good to know what sound I want and why. I just hope I can make it happen before I retire...

Thanks again.

Robin, Nice review of the VTL's and CJ Mono-blocks. Man those CJ's are 'Purdy" ! Glad to hear they didn't disapoint !!

As the others have said , it is trully sweet when the synergy of the equipment all comes together and allows one the 'feeling of being there Live' as you apparently felt !!

BTW, while I was back home in Upstate / Western NY for Easter I found out Madeline is coming to the Eastman Theater of Music(Rochester, NY) in June. Man, I hope I can squeeze that in before the get together in Lawrence !!

Madeleine Peyroux...

twich54 said:

Robin, Nice review of the VTL's and CJ Mono-blocks. Man those CJ's are 'Purdy" ! Glad to hear they didn't disapoint !!

As the others have said , it is trully sweet when the synergy of the equipment all comes together and allows one the 'feeling of being there Live' as you apparently felt !!

BTW, while I was back home in Upstate / Western NY for Easter I found out Madeline is coming to the Eastman Theater of Music(Rochester, NY) in June. Man, I hope I can squeeze that in before the get together in Lawrence !!

Click to expand...

Dave,

Thank you. Yeah, the CJ's were sure pretty or purdy... And yes, it felt as close to 'live' as I think it could have. It is kinda bitter sweet thought though - it's like 'live' and man-made audio are friends but they can never shake hands and meet.

If you do see Madeleine you will be in for a real 'live' treat, she is simply wonderful in concert...

Robin said:

tonyc,

Personally, for me..., I seem to react physiologically to disarmingly sweet tubed sounds. Naturally, it depends so much on the song... It has to be a moving tune as well. I think that's why I always choose Eva Cassidy's "Wonderful World". If the sweetness is there - I'll be crying...
The purity of the lovely musical notes seems to go directly to my heart and I react by becoming emotional (crying). I guess, it is proving to be a good indicator of the highest level of tubed sound quality, which impacts me on a gut level...

If word gets out, folks we'll start wanting me to audition their gear before they buy, just to make doubly sure they are spending large sums on the most emotionally exciting tubed gear possible...

I do trust my ears and my heart as well...

Click to expand...

Eva Cassidy also sounds wonderful on vinyl and when you think about her tragic life, you can really well-up (with tears, that is.) The one that does it for me is S&G's "Kathy's Song"!

Eva Cassidy on Vinyl...

aliveatfive said:

Eva Cassidy also sounds wonderful on vinyl and when you think about her tragic life, you can really well-up (with tears, that is.) The one that does it for me is S&G's "Kathy's Song"!

Click to expand...

aliveatfive,

Now that is a wonderful thought, Eva Cassidy on vinyl! Yes! I am going to have to in vest in Eva on vinyl when I get to that point, that is...


I love how Eva sings S&G's "Kathy's Song" as well.

Rich said:

Then you will have reached true audio nirvana and probably be cured of joeyitis forever.

Click to expand...

Hehehehehhe.. wishful thinking my friends... wishful thinking.... .

Rich said:

Sounds like you had a wonderful audition, Robin. I knew you would appreciate the sound of the CJ gear. The LP 140 monoblocs produce a really sweet midrange and top end. But I'm not surprised you preferred the sound of the VTL. I have always been a proponent of headroom in an amp. A higher wattage amp is simply able to reproduce dynamic transients more accurately, providing more definition and authority to the music.

Of course, you must understand that the things you learned are somewhat colored by the equipment you auditioned them with. By that I mean that these amps will act differently powering the Summits than they did powering the Wilsons. The CJ LP 140 will sound even sweeter and more effortless with the Summits because it is relieved of woofer duty. It is possible that the CJ would sound even better than the VTL on the Summit.

The important thing is that you have listened to three different top brands of tube amplifiers and have begun to get a good feel for the sound that a quality tube amplifier can bring to your system. If you purchase the Summits (or similar) down the road, and you purchase a quality tube amp and preamp from any of the top manufacturers (CJ, BAT, Cary, ARC, Macintosh, Manley, VTL, VAC, etc. etc.) you will have a system that will continually blow your mind and make you cry every time you put on Eva Cassidy. Then you will have reached true audio nirvana and probably be cured of joeyitis forever.

Click to expand...

There is no cure for Joey-itis. It's like Herpes.

Damn you, Joey! My wallet was a safe haven for money prior to finding you and this board!!!

Thanks for the review Robin. Did the dealer mention anything about how the Series II compares to the earlier version of the MB-450?

Hola Robin...it is good to know that you trust your ears and your heart!!! ...I had the chance to do the same thing here with Mr. James Saxon, who represent several hi-end brands here. The C-Js are more lay back than the VLSs but it seams that my ears were made for C-J...please, don't get wrong here...VTLs are super great stuf!..the speakers are Usher and the electronics are CD player Audio Research tubed, and the pre-amp is a Audio Research Reference...wow! these are superb electronics, no matter the brand...all of them provides the musician(s) playing for us...right there...the piano sounded a litle too bright with the VTLs to my liking, but not bad or something to worry about. I think as always, everything is a matter of liking and taste. As an example, I have a customer who uses with his Summits all Audio Research gear, and the sound is breath taking...each time that I go to his place, I can remember his great sound for over a week, singing in my brain...when you have the Summits, and I can say this, there is like to be in the Glory Heaven...you are with the musician(s) and the singer(s) living the same experience that they had...the violin, all strings, the drums, the bass, the organ, (he has two Decent)...and they are setted in a such way that you get the deepest notes but not shaking the room...good review my dear Robin, happy listening to all,
Roberto.

Hey Robin:

If you want the best of both worlds, listen to the Summits with the CJ Premier 350...

I was considering the LP140s for my reference system, but Lew Johnson is a good friend of mine and he suggested the Premier 350. It's solid state, but has 95% of the delicacy of the tube monos, but all the punch of a well designed SS amp. And no tubes to blow ever!

I've had mine for over a year now, and I couldn't be happier. And our local ML rep (that has ARC ref tube gear) was blown away when he listened to my Summits. Of course, I cheat a little bit, using the CJ ACT2/series 2 preamp which has four tubes, but it's a match made in heaven for the Summits!

How can you say that?

tonepub said:

Hey Robin: If you want the best of both worlds, listen to the Summits with the CJ Premier 350... It's solid state, but has 95% of the delicacy of the tube monos, but all the punch of a well designed SS amp.

Click to expand...

OK, but it's that last 5% that makes stats truly deliver the goods! And besides, stats don't require SS damping. That's why the woofers in the Summits have their own SS amps. You really should hear a pair of Summits with a pair of monoblocked McIntosh MC275MkV's. Not schmaltzy (C-J) or dry (ARC), just sweet and neutral

You obviously havent heard the current CJ gear. The Premier 350/ACT 2 completely eclipses the MC 275's in every way. And I'm not saying that
to be a curmudge. I own a pair of them. I just don't use em in that system,
it's like throwing a blanket over the speakers.