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Thread: MLrecommended postion to walls

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    Default MLrecommended postion to walls

    Hi,

    I can understand the position toward the wall behind the speaker being a backward radiating speaker, but what is the concept behind placing them that far (>61cm) from the side walls. Being a line source, the early reflections should be to difficult, so I am thinking that it has to do with the bass integration. Am I correct in thinking that way?

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    Super User C.A.P's Avatar
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    Bass and stage size as well as centering of vocals.. Vocals will get ten feet tall and fill the space between if to wide.. Side walls will emphasize the bass and might muddy it.. Its a 5 way agreement between you and your room and speakers.. 1. being back wall.. I believe in at least 3 feet and preferably 6 for great depth to stage (room dependent for bass)
    2. Side walls for stage width and bass as well as detailed center vocals
    3.Toe angle for final voicing and stage detailing
    4. Rake angle to panel for height and clarity
    5. Seat position.. I recommend at least 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 the distance back from the width as you want the delay a tad after for a nice blooming ML sound
    Martin Logan... Odyssey...Krell KSA 100s...Krell KRC3 Pre Amp...Krell Connect Media server/DAC
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    Forum Administrator twich54's Avatar
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    what Chris said .....................
    Dave

    System #79 - Analog is Alive and Well, if in doubt, click the link below !

    Click Here to see my System

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    Quote Originally Posted by C.A.P View Post
    Bass and stage size as well as centering of vocals.. Vocals will get ten feet tall and fill the space between if to wide.. Side walls will emphasize the bass and might muddy it.. Its a 5 way agreement between you and your room and speakers.. 1. being back wall.. I believe in at least 3 feet and preferably 6 for great depth to stage (room dependent for bass)
    2. Side walls for stage width and bass as well as detailed center vocals
    3.Toe angle for final voicing and stage detailing
    4. Rake angle to panel for height and clarity
    5. Seat position.. I recommend at least 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 the distance back from the width as you want the delay a tad after for a nice blooming ML sound
    Chris, nice, detailed and complete answer. Like electrostatic man inner sound.
    Last edited by M15; 12-17-2016 at 12:50 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by C.A.P View Post
    Bass and stage size as well as centering of vocals.. Vocals will get ten feet tall and fill the space between if to wide.. Side walls will emphasize the bass and might muddy it.. Its a 5 way agreement between you and your room and speakers.. 1. being back wall.. I believe in at least 3 feet and preferably 6 for great depth to stage (room dependent for bass)
    2. Side walls for stage width and bass as well as detailed center vocals
    3.Toe angle for final voicing and stage detailing
    4. Rake angle to panel for height and clarity
    5. Seat position.. I recommend at least 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 the distance back from the width as you want the delay a tad after for a nice blooming ML sound
    Is there a rough distance about what is to far apart?
    I am trying to figure out what screen with I can fit into my room with the Montis. Either behind the screen or at the side of the screen.
    The bigger the screen the closer to the side wall

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    Super User C.A.P's Avatar
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    Its room dependent.If you have a 60 x40 room then you can potentially widen them but seating position must be at least equal or 1 1/4 back .. There are a few here who use a 110 inch screen.. To wide and its ten feet tall and ten feet wide, Imagine a real person sitting on a chair singing. Use a great known recording that you have heard on various systems.. NOT HT ,but rather 2 channel..
    Martin Logan... Odyssey...Krell KSA 100s...Krell KRC3 Pre Amp...Krell Connect Media server/DAC
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    My room is 11 foot wide, and depth is something I can play with depending on screen size and viewing distance.

    The 1.5 x speaker width distance isn't going to be much of a problem.

    I am playing with a possible speaker distance of little less than 8 foot, but speaker sitting less than 2 foot from the side wall to get a 120" screen fit in between. (All in software)

    What are the recommendations for placing a Stage-X centre speaker?

    Sent from my HTC_0PKV1 using Tapatalk

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    I have been able to play around with my speakers this week and did end up with the following setup.

    Distance to side walls >50cm (1.6 ft), distance to back wall 120cm (4 ft), distance between speakers 223cm (7.3 ft), distance from speakers 268cm (8.8 ft).
    I did notice that the speakers don't rely like sound absorption. It can help with sharpen up the sound image at a smaller distances to the back or side wall, but it kills the magic when placed at 120cm (4 ft). I wonder if people have tried different type of diffraction panels with these speaker and to which result?

    But here is the thing, what is actually happening at 120cm (4 ft) from the back wall? 120cm (4 ft) in the speed of sound is 3.5ms, this x 2 for travel to and bouncing back from that wall is a delayed reflection of 7ms. But I got this info from the Audio Physic web site saying the following; "The spatial information relating to a sound source is mainly detected by the brain in the first five milliseconds, everything which follows will at first be ignored. Sound travels at 1.7 metres (5.6 ft) in five milliseconds. If the sound of a reflection has to travel 1.7m (5.6 ft) more than the direct sound of the source, then it will have no influence on our spatialereception." But this 120cm (4 ft) distance does make the sound more airy and gives a more real ambient presence.

    Placing the center at 120cm (4 ft) from the back wall is giving me better results as well, but the effect is less due to it being a mono channel.

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    Super User C.A.P's Avatar
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    The back wall is a key factor also.. Get that seat about 18 inches from your ears and watch bass response go up as well as stage depth.. Many people do not use the back wall to their advantage

    Also get them away from the side walls so you get width outside the speakers.. room width in inches X 18 then multiply by 5 this is dead center panel.. and you will get the starting area of least standing waves..

    height of ceiling in inches x.618 and distance from wall behind speakers FRONT wall
    Last edited by C.A.P; 02-07-2017 at 04:40 PM.
    Martin Logan... Odyssey...Krell KSA 100s...Krell KRC3 Pre Amp...Krell Connect Media server/DAC
    My system here

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    Quote Originally Posted by C.A.P View Post
    The back wall is a key factor also.. Get that seat about 18 inches from your ears and watch bass response go up as well as stage depth.. Many people do not use the back wall to their advantage

    Also get them away from the side walls so you get width outside the speakers.. room width in inches X 18 then multiply by 5 this is dead center panel.. and you will get the starting area of least standing waves..

    height of ceiling in inches x.618 and distance from wall behind speakers FRONT wall
    What do you mean by getting the seat 18 inches from the ears? Do you mean any possible reflection points?

    With the distance from the side walls, did you mean room width divided by 18 multiplied by 5?

    Using the ceiling height calculation I can have a max listen position distance from the speakers of x 1.33 speaker width. And a max distance of 70 cm from the side walls, and 100cm from the back wall.

  11. #11
    Super User C.A.P's Avatar
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    Yes, divided by 18 x 5 and its in INCHES !
    The back wall is help full in bass boost and warmth.. Sit with your head around 18 inches from back wall and see how it sounds ! The bass you loose from closer to front wall is reinforced by the rear ! It don't always work but its worth trying
    Martin Logan... Odyssey...Krell KSA 100s...Krell KRC3 Pre Amp...Krell Connect Media server/DAC
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