Aerius (not i) woofer replacement

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Nitram92

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Hi,

I am looking for woofer replacement concerning my father's ML Aerius (first generation, not i).
I found on the web that "Visaton TIW 200 XS woofer" would be good. Is it the best for this?

Best regards

Maxence
 
What is critical for Aerius's stock crossover is that the replacement woofer is nominally 4 Ohms, has a flat bandwidth past 1k, ~88-89dB/W sensitivity, and is also suited for a sealed box. And it would be really nice if it also fit the existing counterbore of the cabinet!
 
Attached is a comparison of the simulated response for the Visaton W 200 S (4 Ohm) and the ScanSpeak 22W/4534G00 Discovery 8" Woofer (4 ohm, $80 from Madisound) in a 30 liter sealed box. The W200 technically has better simulated low end, but its overall Qtc is not as ideal as that of the Scanspeak 22W/4534G00. Note the two curves cross around 60Hz, and above that the Scanspeak is a tiny bit flatter.
I would choose the Scanspeak for that reason, along with other reasons: fiberglass cone (v paper), cast basket (vs stamped), great reputation, cost(?).

Does it fit the counterbore?!

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-8-woofers/scanspeak-22w/4534g-discovery-8-woofer-4-ohm/
 

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Is this clearer?
 

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I would be more concerned about true transfer function around cross over point replacement driver vs original driver simulated with original passive crossover components. Within 1dB one octave up and down from acoustic cross over frequency (not the electrical one) should be safe.
my 2€
 
Hi,

@Tosh: I did not consider this scanspeak model because it is 3 db more than what you recommended (92 instead of 88-89).
But if it okay to you then we have a deal !
I will check the size on the Aerius concerning the counterbore.

@MPS: I did not get your point. According to you I should investigate more to be sure that the scanspeak model is a good replacement?
 
The Scanspeak I linked to is not 3dB more, because it's given as 2.83V at 1m, which into 4 Ohms is actually 2W, so subtract 3 dB, and its sensitivity is 92.4-3= 89.4dB. Sneaky, right?
 
Hi,

@Tosh: I did not consider this scanspeak model because it is 3 db more than what you recommended (92 instead of 88-89).
But if it okay to you then we have a deal !
I will check the size on the Aerius concerning the counterbore.

@MPS: I did not get your point. According to you I should investigate more to be sure that the scanspeak model is a good replacement?

What I was saying is that simulating how a driver acoustically fits a cabinet is just one and maybe not the most important parameter. I would concentrate more on the crossover frequency region, always the weak point of matching a dipole panel driver to monopole dynamic driver. Just find out (or measure) parameters of the original driver and find as exact match as possible (if possible at all). My first choice would be to repair original drivers if ML can't supply replacement.
 
The Scanspeak I linked to is not 3dB more, because it's given as 2.83V at 1m, which into 4 Ohms is actually 2W, so subtract 3 dB, and its sensitivity is 92.4-3= 89.4dB. Sneaky, right?

Doesn't ML already report voltage sensitivity (dB@2,83V) not the efficiency of the speaker (dB@1W)?
 
I dug around in my stash and found a pair of 8inch 'Sledgehammer' subwoofers made by Eminence and sold by Madisound around 1990. The outside diameter of the basket is 8.25 inches, so I expect that is also the same OD as the original Eminence woofers in the Aerius. IF(!) that is the case then the larger OD (225mm=8.85inch) Scanspeak woofer is not going to be a plug-n-play replacement based on physical fit.
 
If anyone has any other suitable candidates for a replacement woofer for the Aerius, then put them forward, and we can discuss their relative merits.
The information I have from one speaker re-coner is that replacement 4Ohm cone+voicecoil assemblies are not available from Eminence anymore. Either way, it would be my general recommendation to not spend any money repairing and shipping old woofers back and forth.

As for matching ML's sensitivity specs, keep in mind that until not that long ago, ML's spec was basically an 'equivalency' to be used to compare MLs line sources against point source box speakers. I read that admission from ML here on this forum a few years ago but can't find that thread now...

Maxence, please let us know how you feel about these recommendations, and we'll try to find you a local economical solution.
 
Hi Tosh,

Sorry for the delay I was working on an other hifi project.
So I bought a pair of Scan-speak 22W/4534G00. I just mounted it on the Aerius. The result is that there is far too much bass ! What can I do to lower the bass volume? Add a component ?
 
Unfortunately the 22W/4534G00 is a 4 Ohm speaker which is NOT what ML was using in the Aerius (see post 13), so it sounds like my realization did not reach you soon enough?
So now is a great opportunity to go active xo on the bass!
 
I just stumbled on this thread because I'm thinking of going active xo with my Aerius. I wanna run monoblocks tubes for the panels and a stereo solid state amp for the woofers. I'd love to hear suggestions on active crossovers and explanations of what I need to do to bypass the passive ox as well as the scope of tuning that needs to be done to get the panels and woofers balanced. I'm continuing my search through other threads for this info, but thought I'd start here because it's the exact model of speaker, and the thread is pretty current. I don't mean to hijack the thread, but it does sound like it's the solution to the op current issue.
 
Hello,

This is an update of the reconstruction of my '94 Aerius (not i). The Aerius are now equiped with excellent, but discontinued, Peerless woofers HDS-P835026 and with rebuild ESL panels. The bipolar electrolytic capacitors of the low pass filter have been exchanged for Mundorf ECap raw, decreasing significantly the series resistance of the components.

Measurements with REW software / Sonarworks microphone / Scarlett 2i2 DAC, give a F-3dB at ca. 45 Hz. This value confirms the calculations. The bass response seems better than the original version. In my living room, bass level is very nice, held firmly (Audio Research VT60 amp, 4ohms terminal).

The Martin Logan recommended woofer substitute, Peerless SLS-P830667, will give the same F-3dB, with a probable boost of the bass, as the Qtc is slightly increased.

Regards. Renaud ;)
 

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