Cartridge recommendations please - especially any based on direct comparisons..

Doug, if you are feeling fearless, you could consider a Music Maker III Moving Iron cart. The reason I say "fearless" is that I used one in an Ittok rather than an Ekos and suffered the dreaded "Grado Dance" on a small percentage of discs due to pinchwarps. I've heard of even the recommended Hadcock tonearm users also getting this problem so effective mass may not be the only answer....

Now...I can report that someone, purely by chance, stumbled on a possible solution. He reduced the anti-skate by 30% or so and fixed the problem.
Interestingly, Len Gregory now issues an instruction to use the Music Maker with minimal A/S.
This means I'll be re-activating my MMIII - which only has 80hrs or so on the clock - for use on a Graham Phantom when the current cart expires.

This cartridge produces sublime sound that easily compares to the best MCs. You get a real sense of the wood in wooden bodied instruments. The MMIII just breathes natural life into the whole soundstage.
It is also a phenomenal tracker, one of the best in the business. MCs in general aren't great trackers but good enough for music rather than Test discs. Even without fussing too much over VTF etc the MMIII will sail through HFN/RR Test Bands.

I'm currently using a Delos which is more of a real world cartridge than the Kleos (for most folk at least). It punches well above its weight.
(BTW, as you are in the neighbourhood, you are most welcome to borrow the MMIII if you want to be a guinea pig in a low anti-skate experiment ;^)
All the best,

Victor said:

Doug, if you are feeling fearless, you could consider a Music Maker III Moving Iron cart. The reason I say "fearless" is that I used one in an Ittok rather than an Ekos and suffered the dreaded "Grado Dance"

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Thanks for the thoughts Victor! Not sure I feel adventurous enough after decades of MC cartridge! I haven't had one at home for forty years! Eeeeek !

I am interested that you have a Delos which seems to be a great wee performer in the Lyra stable. You like it, I take it? I am kind of set up for a Transfiguration Proteus / Lyra Etna home listen. I shall probably listen to the Proteus and if I love it, then avoid listening to the Etna. My aim in hifi is satisfaction in home music listening so I wouldn't listen to the Etna just out of interest. But if I am not sold on the Proteus would then happily risk having fun with the Etna!!! You could join me if the day suits!!!

Ta for kind offer and reply.

First of all sincere apologies for getting your name wrong, Bruce. (I spotted the error later).
No worries m8, you are already sampling some very esoteric wares there! You've obviously found yourself a very good dealer. ;^)

Yes, the Delos was my first foray into the Lyra stable but I doubt it'll be the last. I've got about 750-800 hrs on it now. It's a remarkable cartridge.
I used to use a lot of Linn MCs on my old LP12 (currently using a Raven/Phantom II) and I was always pleased with their "battleship" build quality and SQ. One of the purely practical beauties of Lyra carts is that fluff build-up, which happens rarely, is virtually ignored by the projected cantilever, whereas carts whose cantilevers are recessed underneath the body can suffer a great deal more interference?
In extreme cases those carts got so clogged up at times that the entire cart could elevated out of the groove altogether (i.e. no sound output at all from the system because the cart was riding on a "cushion"! :O )

An awful lot of people approve of the Transfiguration line-up so please keep the feedback coming.
Best regards,

Victor said:

First of all sincere apologies for getting your name wrong, Bruce. (I spotted the error later).
No worries m8, you are already sampling some very esoteric wares there! You've obviously found yourself a very good dealer. ;^)

Yes, the Delos was my first foray into the Lyra stable but I doubt it'll be the last. I've got about 750-800 hrs on it now. It's a remarkable cartridge.

An awful lot of people approve of the Transfiguration line-up so please keep the feedback coming.
Best regards,

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Cheers! I like the fluff story.... That gradually decreasing definition ......!!! My Phoenix doesn't seem to be a dust collector happily. I only use a carbon fibre and velvet type duster and no cleaning machine, but I have nearly all my vinyl from new, with a few second hand LPs only that I get cleaned at my local dealer. I enjoy keeping the vinyl end of things low intensity!
Thanks for the encouragement in my cartridge comparison, shall certainly post here when it happens. I will be phoning in the next few days and it will be interesting to see how quickly they are available. The joke goes that Lyra designs more cartridges than it makes! But that is probably affected by masses of LP12 users upgrading to the Linn (Lyra) Kandid over the last year or so. Demand for that should have tailed off somewhat now, so here's hoping!

Hola Guys!, I am using right now a wonderful sounding cartridge and it has pennies price: The Denon 103R. Its well balanced, with very nice tracking ability, clear, highs very steady and great with timbre. I am not too convinced with the bass performance, but I think is due to the tone arm that I am using in my LP-12. Its the Unitrack by Magnepan...yes, an oldie, but works nice...just my 2 cents...happy listening!

Dougster said:

Cheers! I like the fluff story.... That gradually decreasing definition ......!!! My Phoenix doesn't seem to be a dust collector happily. I only use a carbon fibre and velvet type duster and no cleaning machine, but I have nearly all my vinyl from new, with a few second hand LPs only that I get cleaned at my local dealer. I enjoy keeping the vinyl end of things low intensity!
Thanks for the encouragement in my cartridge comparison, shall certainly post here when it happens. I will be phoning in the next few days and it will be interesting to see how quickly they are available. The joke goes that Lyra designs more cartridges than it makes! But that is probably affected by masses of LP12 users upgrading to the Linn (Lyra) Kandid over the last year or so. Demand for that should have tailed off somewhat now, so here's hoping!

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You are a man after my own heart Bruce, I never clean vinyl either but prefer to use services for that job. All of my original mostly 120g 70s/80s vinyl is uncleaned from new and still sounds superb (and noiseless) to this day. You do get the very occasional one which is less than perfect but when that happens there are questions in Parliament. ;^)
It's never bad enough to force me to clean them though.
I tend to avoid those plush velvet brushes and anything which pushes dirt into the groove rather than letting it lie on the surface. Cleanliness, for me, involves using anti-static liners plus a zerostat (and of course regularly brushing the stylus with a dry carbon brush). If there is a large piece of debris lying on a record I'll tear off a tiny strip of kitchen roll and flick the debris off using the "ragged point" on the tip of the paper. That way I don't create any static either. (I know paper has powder in it when torn but that also applies to LP sleeves ;^)
Believe it or not my regime is a lot cleaner now than it was 25 years ago. 40 years of esoteric T/T ownership later has shown that very little was ever needed, just clean habits. Discharge static before & after every play then put the LP straight into it's sleeve. If the sleeve is anti-static you can play it immediately without zerostat treatment and extend the life of the gun. Afterwards store the LPs inside a cabinet which has doors on it to act as an additional protective dust seal. (Plastic outer covers were also helpful in this regard). New ones are flimsier but tend to have an adhesive seal on them.

One thing that impacts on the life/efficiency of a cart is fragments of metal from non-virgin vinyl which get sucked straight into the generator by the MC's powerful magnet. Not much you can do there except ask the manufacturer to de-contaminate the interior. (Which, to their credit, they'll do for free).

Roberto, good choice! The Denon is an enduring classic. I've heard of guys using that cartridge in turntables costing a king's ransom.

Thanks Victor...I stop buying expensive cartridges, when our maid came to my room, and did a cleaning of a lot of dust in my turntables, and did a very nice job cleaning everything and everywhere. The cleaning was so good, the disappear the needles of my black Koetsu, my Rosewood Koetsu and my Sumiko Talisman 3. My fault here. I did not tell here of do not come to my room to do the cleaning for obvious reason. I was so depressed that I did stop to listening analogue, having great turntables. Now I am back with this Denon. I remember that one of my very first MC was the Denon 101, then the 103D...and a lot of others, always seeking tracking ability, naturalness, timbre and dynamics. Even had the Strain Gauge by Zao Win, and ended with the last that I mentioned. Happy listening!

I have always found the 103 in all its variations to be very smooth sounding cartridge, boring but smooth. To my taste it homogenizes the music too much and lacks the dynamics of the Linn cartridges or the Dynavectors.

YMMV

roberto said:

Hola Guys!, I am using right now a wonderful sounding cartridge and it has pennies price: The Denon 103R. Its well balanced, with very nice tracking ability, clear, highs very steady and great with timbre. I am not too convinced with the bass performance, but I think is due to the tone arm that I am using in my LP-12. Its the Unitrack by Magnepan...yes, an oldie, but works nice...just my 2 cents...happy listening!

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Roberto,

I have inbound a variant of this cartridge that I bought based upon a listening last year in the Zu Audio room at RMAF, and an unfortunate moment of mental relapse just last week.

I had been listening to some vinyl, but when I went to flip an album (Sinatra at the Sands), as I always do I muted my Aesthetix Rhea phono stage. Unfortunately for me, since my phono stage is in a new position in my rack, I unknowingly hit the "Degauss" button instead of Mute. As you may all surmize, - degaussing a Moving Magnet cartridge such as my Grado Statement leads to catastrophic results. By the time I realized my misstep the damage was done. The cartridge was about 15 years old, so it was time for considering my next step anyway. Still, I felt like an idiot with my "Senior moment".

Not sure what I wanted to replace it with I remembered listening to this Zu Audio modified variant on the Denon 103R and decided to investigate it further.

From their website:

The Zu/DL-103R Mk.II is a high performance 2-channel stereo moving coil phonograph pickup. The R version has revised coil winding and wire, resulting in lower internal impedance and slightly less output. Generally the 103R has a bit more treble presence than the regular 103. Though the 103R is more money and hyped as a superior version by Denon, it is really more like a variation, for those that have a phono stage that matches better with the lower impedance or a system, or listener that needs a bit more treble push.

Each pickup is comprehensively tested and graded, the better the grade the better the stereophony, but even the standard is pretty damn fine.

The Mk.II update is significant, both in performance and handling usage. The body is machined from 6061-T6 and hard anodized to aid in the matching of tonearm-mount properties and further reduce pickup stored energy. The shape of the housing has also been refined to reduce resonance and stress risers resulting in a much stronger design that better supports the motor assembly. We have also changed the epoxy matrix formulation that binds the assembly further reducing mechanical noise and positions increased stability to the stylus. In short we have been able to keep the great tone of the original Zu/DL-103R but give significantly improved transparency. Handling usage has also been considered and improved, with design elements to help safeguard the stylus from accidental damage, stylus guard being the most obvious feature.

I just went back to their website to check on the specifications and I discovered that I actually got the very last one! I'm anxious to get it mounted and give it a listen.

Hey Tim, you won't regret it! I know that some serious music lovers here at the forum don't like this cartridge, I can say that in my system, with my turntables, with my music, its great!

Now I do know why I had that bass thing. What I did is adding a little mass to the cartridge with little clay, (just a little) and the high frequency resonance body was cancelled and got the quality bass that I was looking for. Its clean, good in detail, pristine midrange, vocals are palpable, good air between instruments, not perfect, but a very balanced.

Does tracks better than others more expensive. To my ears, I find it very musical. I do respect other opinions, of course. Remember that sound its a matter of liking. What its important to my ears, could be not important to others, and vice-versa. I will wait your comments to it my friend. I assure you that you will like it too, as I do. Happy listening!

suffice it to say, those of us that have done analog for a loooong time know there is no 'best' cartridge out there !

twich54 said:

suffice it to say, those of us that have done analog for a loooong time know there is no 'best' cartridge out there !

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Still fun to share what we like.... though personal taste and system matching are really important. i think its interesting how serendipity it all is when it comes to cartridges as its so hard to compare directly. Cymbiosis in Leicester UK offers comparisons between Linn (basically Lyra) Dynavector and Lyra via Naim Aro unipivot wands, but extrapolating from non Linn family speakers to electrostats is somewhat of a guessing game!!

How's the Cart Tim? Hope no senior moments in the instal process!!

Dougster said:

Still fun to share what we like.... though personal taste and system matching are really important. i think its interesting how serendipity it all is when it comes to cartridges as its so hard to compare directly. Cymbiosis in Leicester UK offers comparisons between Linn (basically Lyra) Dynavector and Lyra via Naim Aro unipivot wands, but extrapolating from non Linn family speakers to electrostats is somewhat of a guessing game!!

How's the Cart Tim? Hope no senior moments in the instal process!!

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I just recieved it last night Bruce. Going to install it tonight I hope (depends on how soon I can leave the office). Luckily it's very easy to remove the arm wand on my JMW tonearm and do the work at my desk under good light as opposed to trying to hover upside down at the table mounting it. I will NOT be drinking any single barrel prior to the installation and alignment. Did I mention that my friend Mr. Blanton might have been a factor in my recent misfortune? Nah, best just to keep that tucked away. When my wife questioned what was in the package I recieved last night I explained my error (omitting that last bit), and she just shook her head at me.

MiTT said:

Did I mention that my friend Mr. Blanton might have been a factor in my recent misfortune?

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I hope the sonics lead to celebrating with one when it's all finished! Shame it's not Bunnahabhain!!

Have fun

Dougster said:

I hope the sonics lead to celebrating with one when it's all finished! Shame it's not Bunnahabhain!!

Have fun

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I got it installed last night. It's always a bit of a nervous exercise getting a new cartridge mounted, making sure the lead wires are correct, setting the balance, overhang, azimuth, tracking force etc. It's much heavier than my old Grado, so I was nervous about how far back I had to move the counterweight, but then it hit me that I needed to then set the tarcking force, so that brought things back inward from the end of the arm wand. Got it all dialed in perfectly and started up an album, but I only was getting sound from the right channel! Off came the arm wand again, back to the desk to check all the connections, then back to the TT to reassess all the alignment was good. Still no left channel. I was starting to freak out thinking I'd gotten a lemon, when I remembered that I had moved my pre-amp around when I was solving an issue relating to my computer recognizing my DAC (also solved, seperate topic), and sure as hell, when I went to check the connection at the pre-amp the right channel was very loose. Pushed it back on and Viola!, I was back in business.

Roberto, your basic assessment of this cartridge is spot on. Tones and timbres are all very natural. Nothing calls attention to itself, but by virture of not throwing a spotlight on anything in particular. While listening to a Living Stereo reissue of the Seblius 6th Symphony I was able to hear each instrument without others intruding. I don't recall who felt that the original Denon's were "homogonizing" the music, but that certainly wasn't my experience with this Zu modified unit. Rather, I was hearing very good detail retrieval (better than my Grado), but substantailly presented as a cohesive whole. If I have a nit to pick I would say that overall the Grado gave me a better sense of ambience or space, but that might just be a matter of the new cartridge breaking in. Listening to Dianna Krall "Live in Paris" later the ambience in this recording seemed improved. Dynamics and articulation are slightly better than with the Grado (but I need to remember that the Grado was 15 years old, and likely needed some reconditioning). I was easily following John Clayton's amazing bass lines in the Krall recording with rapt attention. Dynamics on Dead Can Dance's "Spiritchaser" were fantastic, again, there was no homogonizing of the detail or flow of the music. In short, I am very impressed and pleased with this relatively inexpensive cartridge thus far. I was up well past my typical bedtime enjoying my music and can't wait to spend more time with it this weekend.

I did add some play dough to make dead the body of the cartridge...a little bit only, and now I am liking what I am listening. The bass now is robust and well defined. More tracking ability, and more air between the instruments. Still I have to work more, because my digital Benchmarck is doing a fantastic job. Yes, I know. There is no comparison between Digital and analogue. The truth is, yes the sound presentation of both medias, are totally different. There are things that I do like better in digital, and other that I hate, like the left over at the edges of the voices...and in analogue, sometimes its too dirty, the vertical distortion, is awful. The missing tracking ability, the wow and flutter, the resonance for certain notes and sometimes everything is right image center, no sound at the left or the right, being a stereo recording. But the ritual that involves to play a record is just...fantastic! Also, I get disturbed my the surface noise. Well, nothing is perfect!
Enjoy your new cartridge...its a great value for what I gives...happy listening!

Good news Tim, pleased for you. It's great when something simple like the preamp connection resolves a panic! Stereo always sounds more amazing after listening to only one channel! Hope you keep enjoying it. I wouldn't like a homogenised sound at all (who would mind you!) so pleased the mod seems to avoid that pitfall.
Time to drink that bourbon? Sorry, Bunnahbhainn not available via steaming services yet!!!

Tim, glad to hear all is well in 'analog land' !

twich54 said:

Tim, glad to hear all is well in 'analog land' !

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Thanks Dave. Got to spend some quality time in the listening room this morning by virtue of some very wet weather this weekend here in Colorado. That's fine by me, got to listen to a LOT of great music this morning while the rain was falling. Very much enjoying myself.

.........Transfiguration..........