Fuses

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i read the link to 'audio asylum' …………….. it reconfirms why they call that place an 'asylum' ……...
 
When I lived in Maine I had an employee that had spent time in the UL facility in the Portland area. When someone would mention UL he would shake his head and say, "For the proper amount they would put a UL sticker on a Peanut Butter sandwich". He didn't think much of the organization.

This relates to the Asylum link conversation.
 
When someone would mention UL he would shake his head and say, "For the proper amount they would put a UL sticker on a Peanut Butter sandwich". He didn't think much of the organization.

Brad, I would think that would happen only after jelly was added !
 
Agree it is potentially very dangerous to change the electrical safety specification of any electric appliance. Amplifiers included, and potentially moreso than many other appliances.

I don't doubt that fuses can change the sound of some amplifiers - but surely the impacts will be minimised in a properly designed amplifier?
 
A lot of quality brands give mediocre parts. The fuse might be a piece of Crap wire.
 
A lot of quality brands give mediocre parts. The fuse might be a piece of Crap wire.

Seriously - if you're paying either side of $10,000 for an amplifier and getting crap parts, then you're being ripped - no two ways about it.

I don't know what fuses I've got in my amp - but I do determine the holistic "overall" by listening, and trust that the manufacturer has used a fuse (whether good or otherwise) which gives the best ROI for that particular product.

That is not to say - of course - that it can't be improved. Of course it can. But more importantly, it is about ROI.

What return on investment can you get by changing fuses? And what return on investment can you get by changing amplifiers?

I think most people will agree that - in most cases - the latter will win every time. No manufacturer is going to sell [say] a $5,000 amplifier when they could command $10,000 for the same amplifier by spending an extra $100 on fuses.

The manufacturer should know what components will sound best in his amplifier. And if he doesn't, then it doesn't really say much for your amplifier design in general. I certainly wouldn't outlay more than $50 on an amplifier if I didn't have total confidence that the partiular piece of equipment was giving me the best ROI possible.

I really don't think big names like Classé, ARC, BMC, Ypsilon, Technical Brain, Lamm, Naim, et. al. are selling amplifiers which could be markedly improved by simple fuse changes!! If these fuses (or other accessories) improved thier products in any meaningful way, by that margin, they would most obviously build them into the design.
 
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All those brands you mention wool give you upgrades. The crossovers on most speakers are crap quality. Paul (ps68) upgraded his ML crossovers and got major benefit. The 50k dali mega line gets a massive boost from crossover upgrades. All amps and CD players, if you upgrade the quality of resistors and caps you should get massive boost at a low cost. Many long term audiophiles I know who can diy have modded most of their components, and those who can't diy ship the amp to some guy and pay him a bit to diy it. A lot of these upgrades have to do with changing quality of resistors and caps.

The reason products like the lampizator are so good is that because he is a smaller shop, and a DIYer, he is producing a dac with quality components at lower margins to take on the likes of msb who charge 10:1.

Some audiophiles believe that you are not an audiophile unless you mod your system over the years. I guess Jonfo does that.

The problem with making these mods is that you void any warranty, or lose out the resale value unless you are a well respected DIYer

Back to fuses, I got some improvement replacing the one on my ARC ref 110. My ref 3 came with a replaced fuse anyway, the guy I bought it from is an ex dealer and ex CLX owner.

The reason fuse replacements are popular is that they can be done easily by people who can't diy at a low cost. AMR costs just 15 quid a fuse here. Some of my favorite dealers with the best systems have all fuses upgraded, and no, they don't sell them. They have done that for their own system.

Consistent reports are that if you replace all fuses in your system you will get a massive boost in dynamics
 
Regarding your point of what the manufacturer know will sound best, yes, but he also has to with towards a margin. So he uses the right value for his caps, just uses a Chinese made cheap cap instead of a quality one, for example
 
Regarding your point of what the manufacturer know will sound best, yes, but he also has to with towards a margin. So he uses the right value for his caps, just uses a Chinese made cheap cap instead of a quality one, for example

Fully agree - that's why I didn't say you could not improve on the OEM components. I was talking about ROI - If you could get a meaningful improvement for minimal cost then the manufacturer would do that in balancing the [sound v pricepoint] of his final product.

The reason the manufacturer might use cheap fuses is because for the extra money spent on fuses versus the the potential sound quality improvement, it would not command a $ premium high enough to recoup the costs.

For me, that tells me my money is best spent elsewhere.

Sorry - I might be coming across as anti-tweaking. I'm most certainly not. I just think that the money spent on tweaks can be so great some audiophiles are missing the big picture.

Even if you get a meaningful gain in performance every time - there comes a time when you've spent so much money improving the performance of your Hyundai that you could have bought a Ferrari.
 
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Fully agree - that's why I didn't say you could not improve on the OEM components. I was talking about ROI - If you could get a meaningful improvement for minimal cost then the manufacturer would do that in balancing the [sound v pricepoint] of his final product.

The reason the manufacturer might use cheap fuses is because for the extra money spent on fuses versus the the potential sound quality improvement, it would not command a $ premium high enough to recoup the costs.

For me, that tells me my money is best spent elsewhere.

Oh sure, you can spend it upgrading resistors, capacitors, and output stages, all of which the manufacturer would have compromised on. Just that fuses is easier to do, even if they might have a lower bang for the buck. I won't do a complex mod even if it's better ROI without giving it weeks and months of thought. On the other hand, fuses, just order of the web, cheap, insert, chuck out old one. Easy. Also it helps when a company specialises in something, for example, fuses, because they can generate a better quality fuse at a lower price. Anyway, we are speculating. Best to insert and try
 
The only way I think (????) you could make a determination of any sonic difference is to install the fuse(s), listen to the system for an extended period, and then reinstall the stock fuses.
 
Yes. I personally could not make out a difference between Furutech and Audio Magic in my amp, but could between Furutech and stock. But fuses are not easy to compare one by one, I guess take a leap of faith and replace all by SR RED and then check. They need around 2 weeks burn in time but you don't need music to be played then, as long as they are connected they burn in. With all fuses replaced I guess the difference should be easy to make out
 
Yes. I personally could not make out a difference between Furutech and Audio Magic in my amp, but could between Furutech and stock. But fuses are not easy to compare one by one, I guess take a leap of faith and replace all by SR RED and then check. They need around 2 weeks burn in time but you don't need music to be played then, as long as they are connected they burn in. With all fuses replaced I guess the difference should be easy to make out
At $60+ a pop for a fuse it makes it an expensive test if you replace all fuses with SR fuses.
 
Expensive compared to what, in hifi? Still cheaper than one cable, for example. Also AMR is 15 quid. You will get benefits from either.
 
Expensive compared to what, in hifi? Still cheaper than one cable, for example. Also AMR is 15 quid. You will get benefits from either.
Yeah, but if you don't like the cable you can sell it, whereas I imagine that it would not be quite so easy to sell pre-enjoyed fuses.
 
All components inside a amplifier have a purpose to serve.

To my mind fuses serve to protect the circuitry from damage that may be caused through over amperes entering the amplifier circuitry.

To my mind the best fuse in the world for amplifier not make it perform beyond its electronics potential. with the best fuse for the task one simply acquires 100% amplifier performance.
Changing fuses has less impact on sound than upgrading to highest quality capacitors etc.
 
All components inside a amplifier have a purpose to serve.

To my mind fuses serve to protect the circuitry from damage that may be caused through over amperes entering the amplifier circuitry.

To my mind the best fuse in the world for amplifier not make it perform beyond its electronics potential. with the best fuse for the task one simply acquires 100% amplifier performance.
Changing fuses has less impact on sound than upgrading to highest quality capacitors etc.

Agreed, but as I previously mentioned, changing caps is not for everybody unless you can DIY while anyone can change a fuse with almost no time investment
 

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