replace dual abysses w/ single descent i?

Hey Everyone,
I've been contemplating replacing my dual abyss setup with a single Descent i. While I am extremely pleased with my abyss setup as far as music is concerned; they seem to be lacking the authority below 30hz that i would like for my HT. I guess I am shooting for something with more "tactile" output and i am wondering if with all things being equal, would the superior Descent i outperform the dual Abysses by a wide enough margin that one could justify the upgrade. I'd like to apologize upfront for being so vague but I figured at worst, I'd be able to get a fresh perspective from the experts. The room is 21'x13'x8.5' and my setup consist of: ML Purity mains, ML Feature c.channel, (dual) ML Abyss and Klipsch RS42 surrounds x3. I am still putting the finishing touches on the room but I have yet to install ANY acoustic treatments. I already know the room isn't even close to being optimized yet...but im starting to think that even after treatments and properly dialing in the Room EQ that i'll still be missing the "extension" that i am blindly chasing. Any suggestions, tips, or criticisms are more than welcome.

I guess it depends on how much the low end means to you. A single Descent i should hugely out perform two Abysses though. More attack, more rumble, and much faster.

However, I think a Descent i is also serious overkill for your system, not to mention being physically pretty huge. The Abyss isn't servo controlled, where everything from the Grotto up is. You might strongly consider getting one or two of the Grotto i, or a single Depth i.

Do keep in mind though, if you use a single subwoofer rather than two, you might be able to tell where the bass is coming from if it isn't positioned quite right.


Alternatively, while I have a pair of Purities in my office that I really like, and the bass is not bad in a fairly tiny room, they bass of the Purities really isn't very good. If you're looking at a $2000+ subwoofer like the Descent i, you might want to listen to the Vantages or even Summits/Spires if your budget allows ($4900 used is a lot of money, but a very good price on them). It's possible that with higher end front channel, you wouldn't feel the need for a subwoofer at all. Of course, even if you liked speakers without a subwoofer, that would be opening the door for you to want to add a subwoofer later...

Hello,
I would say a single Descent i would blow away dual Abyss. While I realize having dual subwoofers is most advantageous for room response, but the Decent i is truly a special product and leapfrogs you way up the ladder from Design Series to the flagship ESL Series.

The Descent i is a masterpiece. (3) 250 watt RMS amplifiers driving each 10' woofer, Balanced Force (Drivers spaced 120 degrees apart to cancel vibration), and much more. Simply in another league than your Abyss.

While perhaps overkill, will provide an excellent foundation to your system.
Cheers,
ML

Thnx for the quick reponses guys:bowdown:

I've definitely thought about upgrading the entire front stage along with adding the Descent I. But honestly at my level of development, i have yet to acquire "the ears" to fully appreciate it...not to mention the finances or space . I just figured that the Descent I would would be the best "bang for the buck" while providing the most tangible and enjoyable upgrade (for HT). "Overkill" had definitely come to mind when I started thinking about the replacement. But I've come to realize over years that my ears are quite fickle. The signature "ML" sound that i am so enthralled with now may not be "my cup-o-tea" 5 years from now...But an excellent sub could probably anchor any system that my "stupid" ears will ever lead me to.
I really don't know what to make of it, but somewhere along the path to becoming a junior "audiophile" I took a wrong turn and became a ""speaker whore."

here is what I noticed about my descent... for music it can disappear if you have it out of the corner.... for HT - you don't really know its on - and then your walls start to shake....and I mean that.....there was a thread about the jl audio sub floating around here somewhere -- go take a look at that - I have never heard one so I can not comment - but, if you are going to pay some decent money on a sub - might as well go look at both if you can...

Update!

Well I finally decided to go ahead and pickup a radioshack spl meter(dunno why it took so long:duh Anyhow, according to the spl meter; there IS measurable output down to about 18hz. Problem is that from my listening position there really isn't anything remotely usable below 30hz or so...which i guess is expected. I am starting think about maybe just adding a third no-nonsense, large "low-end" only sub to handle everything below 35hz, or maybe even some buttkickers. As it is, i think i simply need something that moves more air.

You could go that route but then you would be missing out on the Feel and experience that only "quality" bass sonics can provide. Don't discount the performance of the Depth I or equivalent sub.

A freq meter is a useful tool but no substitute for the human experience.

If you have output to 18hz at one location, but don't at your listening location, it would seem you have a null condition there. Perhaps some bass absorbers at the front wall/corners, or a repositioning of the subs might help? You may be pleasantly surprised and get the extension you are looking for.

Problem solved!

Who woulda thought that my solution would've been an Audyssey DSX-equipped AVR (onkyo 807). I picked it up yesterday and dove straight into the MultEQ setup and needless to say I couldn't be happier with the results. While I expected everything to improve I was completely unprepared for the improvement in the "low-end." I was convinced that my issues were purely a result of the limitations of my equipment and room...boy am i glad to find out I was MOSTLY wrong. Not only is the bass response SUBSTANTIALLY smoother, it also extends lower with a "confidence" that was not present before. You guys should've seen my face after running the a few 10-30hz bass sweeps ..I thought recessed lightning was gonna fall from the ceiling! I can only imagine what a ML Descent would do in the same setting.:bowdown: In any case, i just wanted to thank all those who contributed. Cheers. :cheers:

here's a few quick and dirty pics of the temporary setup. Treatments, MAJOR wire management, and a new audio cabinet are still on the the way!